Escaping Rome! To Discover Lazio’s Rich Culture
Podcast Available on Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Pandora | iHeart Radio
Episode summary
In this episode, Brian and Anthony discuss the intricacies of planning a trip to Italy, emphasizing the importance of local partners and the hidden gems of the Lazio region.
They explore the cultural diversity of Italy, the unique culinary experiences, and the value of stepping outside the typical tourist paths to discover authentic Italian experiences. The conversation highlights the significance of understanding regional differences and the benefits of having knowledgeable guides to enhance the travel experience.
In this conversation, the hosts explore the rich cultural and historical landscape of Lazio, Italy, emphasizing the importance of local experiences and the diversity of the region. They discuss hidden gems, the allure of local cuisine, and the contrast between the bustling city of Rome and the serene outskirts.
The conversation highlights the significance of understanding Roman culture through local interactions and the various landscapes that make Lazio a unique travel destination.
Additionally, they address the challenges of tourism in Rome, especially during peak seasons, and suggest alternatives for a more authentic experience.
Key takeaways
Planning is crucial for a successful trip to Italy.
Expectations should be set realistically for travelers.
Local partners enhance the travel experience significantly.
Lazio is a region rich in history and culture.
Italian cuisine varies greatly by region and locality.
Travelers often miss out on hidden gems near Rome.
Day trips can provide a refreshing escape from busy cities.
Understanding local customs enriches the travel experience.
The diversity of Italy is a key attraction for visitors.
Trusting knowledgeable guides can lead to unforgettable experiences. Lazio offers beautiful castles and local strawberries at Lake Nemi.
Avoiding crowded tourist spots can enhance the travel experience.
Italy’s diversity makes it an inexhaustible destination.
Local guides provide invaluable context and immersion in culture.
Many Romans rarely visit major tourist attractions like the Vatican.
The southern part of Lazio is more beachy and relaxing.
Historical sites in southern Lazio are less touristy and worth visiting.
Mozzarella from Lazio is a must-try for food lovers.
Rome can be overwhelming, and exploring Lazio is a great alternative.
Ancient Ostia provides insight into how Romans lived.
Episode Transcript
Brian (00:00)
Hey everybody, welcome back around again. You’re listening to the Bella Italy podcast.
Hey everybody, we are back around again. Anthony and Brian, Brian and Anthony coming at you with another live record in studio. Hi Fidelity. We have a proper recording going on here. ⁓ First and only time in the Bella Italy podcast history and happy to welcome back to the microphone. Mr. Anthony, how are you doing?
Anthony (00:25)
I like that.
Good, Brian, good to see you. And here in Nashville, we’re in a major recording studio, because that’s the kind of influence we have in the podcast. we wanted to… We could. Some swift names we can give you.
Brian (00:51)
to drop names we
know who they
Italians all over the world would be impressed with the country music artists that have recorded here.
Anthony (01:15)
Yes, yes. We are excited for our guest today, who’s better than any artist who’s ever been at this.
Brian (01:22)
studio.
⁓ So before we get to that introduction, if you are tuning in, thank you for being here. God bless you for your patience wading through the murky depths of season four here. ⁓ We started off this season talking about your mindset and some of the characteristics and just what you need.
to get the most out of Italy. mean, come on, you’re planning, you’re waiting for months in advance, you’re dropping a bucket load of change into the, it’s an investment coming over and having that vacation. Hopefully walking away with a lifetime’s worth of experiences that you will think about, talk about and relish forever. But to get there, obviously there’s some obstacles. There’s some hurdles.
along the way, Italy, you know, the decade or so that I’ve lived there, I always say it’s a great place to visit. There’s bureaucracy, there is just tough. mean, it’s not the easiest place on the planet. Every time I come back to middle Tennessee, I’m delighted with how easy, you know, even Leonardo, one of our guys on our team, he’s like, there’s so much space here, it’s so…
clean, everything’s orderly. And I’m thinking, you can imagine my shot coming from Catania. mean, my gosh. But yeah, so there’s so many obstacles a lot of the times to you getting out of it what you’re hoping for. And that’s the biggest challenge is having the right planning. We’ve talked about this, learning to pivot the patients that you need. Those are the three Ps that we talked about. like that?
⁓ We talked about bringing that to the table so that you can come over, you’re relaxed, you can, you know, that curiosity to learn, to understand, to appreciate, so that you can enjoy your vacation. And that’s what, you know, the other side of the coin, and this is kind of the hidden part, I guess, of what, just because it’s behind the scenes, it is our partners that really make that happen. We hopefully,
are finding the right people. And when I’m talking about we as a, you you might be thinking, well, the podcast, no, I’m talking about Italy with Bella. And so, you know, just shameless plug. If you’re thinking, if you’re planning to go to Italy, do yourself a favor, go to Italy with Bella. You can find us online, italywithbella.com. Sign up for a free consultation with Anthony, his wife, Denise, no strings attached, completely free just to investigate and find out.
But hopefully we’re doing a good job of setting the right expectations for our guests coming over to Italy so that what they expect is not informed by their cousin Joe, who went last year and had three Instagrammable moments that they then seek to replicate. But instead they come over to appreciate, to understand, to absorb as much as they can about
the incredible, wonderful Italian culture that you and I, that’s what we’re passionate about, is sharing that culture with others.
Anthony (04:52)
And because of what we do, which is help, consult, build trips, lead, whether it’s logistics, but biggest thing about it, and you mentioned that, is to have the right person on the other side in the country. ⁓ We can tell them how well we know restaurants. We can tell them, you that you needed to get the A train or the train in Termini or whatever. But if you don’t have the right partner to lead them,
Brian (05:06)
receive them and walk them through that process.
Anthony (05:19)
and to have the experience that we supposedly brag about and what you should expect and what you should do, then it’s for naught, right? So we want to make sure, and we’re going to talk about one of my favorite partners at all, the country is ⁓ here today, is to make sure that we find the right partner. We don’t find them on blogs. We don’t find them on Google. We find them because we go out there and we search for locals that have the same passion, the same vision.
to have experiences that they can rave about for years to come.
Brian (05:52)
Yeah, the win for us, for our team, is that guest coming back saying, oh my God, what an incredible experience. I absolutely loved it. I can’t wait to go back.
Anthony (06:05)
Exactly.
Brian (06:16)
So all of that to say segue into the importance of our partners, that hidden part behind the scenes, that person on the other side that’s waiting to chaperone you or guide you through an immersive experience beyond your expectations and that wow experience that I think we would all like to have.
back on the show again. from Rome, direct from Rome. Thank you for being here again. Yeah, thank you. You’re not only one of our first guests, you’re the first guest to be on- Twice. Twice.
Anthony (06:58)
put it this way, my wife, who’s founder of the company, only been on once. So I’m gonna hear about this. Who is this woman, Ava? She asked me, do you have my husband’s number? Of course I do!
Brian (07:13)
So thank you for being on the show again with us today.
Anthony (07:17)
Thank you for letting me in. I was knocking on the door. Please! I am the right partner! Please!
Brian (07:22)
Give me one more chance.
Back by popular demand, let’s say. No, we were thrilled because, you know, coming away from the other episode that we did with you, the first thing I think that came to my mind was we only scratched the surface of what we could talk about with you because you have such an incredible depth of knowledge. You’re one of our most well-informed, well-experienced, well-traveled
partners that we have. And so, you know, we come away thinking, my God, the possibilities are absolutely endless and there’s so many different directions. And so the hard part was defining, okay, what should not what could, but what should we talk about and discuss with you again? And, know, you are Roman. And so we thought, okay, yeah.
Rome is an incredible experience and we’ve talked about that on the previous episode. What people don’t know, and here’s the big reveal at the very beginning here, what people don’t know is that Rome is not a region.
Anthony (08:37)
It’s not surrounded by space.
Brian (08:39)
desert. It’s not an oasis. It’s a lovely city, a mega, you know, for Italian standards, a mega city, an international city with an incredible history spanning thousands of years. That said, it is set in a region, Lazio, ⁓ that I thought, man, this is, you know, it’s kind of the hidden part because it’s just overshadowed. Do you think
Yeah, lot of our, you know, even ourselves or our guests that come over, they hit Rome and they immediately escape, you know.
Anthony (09:17)
It’s interesting because it’s as if the Romans just built in Rome and once they were finished they said now we’re gonna go a hundred miles north or anything else.
Brian (09:26)
Instead of 50 miles.
Right. And so we’ve got we’ve got lots of and I’d love for you to just give us start with a big picture. The overview, lots of as a region, I think for a lot of Americans is unknown.
Anthony (09:43)
Okay, so Latvia is a very fascinating region. First of all, this has to do with all of Italy. We’ve been divided into different countries for over a thousand years. So of course, wherever you go, but even in the span of 30 miles, the food is different, the language is different, the culture is different, because we have nothing to share. We had nothing to share for a thousand years.
Brian (10:11)
That city state kind of model where every little thing is pocketed and becomes its own thing and that’s very Italian I mean you find that all over I find that in Sicily we find that in the north It’s encapsulated. It’s it’s in its own little bubble a lot of times that I think that’s what’s incredibly beautiful about Italy is the diversity you go five kilometers away and you have a different experience of our problem
as Americans coming over, we know Rome and then we know Florence in two totally different regions. And like you’re saying, the food’s different, the access, everything’s different by then. But that happens even 10 kilometers outside of Rome. You begin to have a different kind of experience and you’re still in the same region.
Anthony (11:04)
And
we do that all the time. ⁓ Every weekend, if we can, we go to a different village and there is so much to see. It’s a never ending story. You can go and see Etruscan tombs or a medieval village or a Renaissance palace or a Renaissance villa. Or you can go and see the Roman villa of a Namper and a village that looks completely different. You can go and try
Tiela in Gaeta and if you talk about Tiela in Rome, they have no idea what you’re talking about.
Brian (11:40)
So what is Tiala?
Anthony (11:42)
What is Tiel?
Brian (11:46)
We
gotta give them a little bit more than that. What a tease that is. What their appetite.
Anthony (11:52)
Okay, so Tiala is a sort of pie that they make traditionally in Gaeta. And they make one that is with octopus, little mini octopuses and tomato sauce. It’s so good. And another one with vegetables. And it’s basically a pie with a crust that it’s local. So of course the ingredients are similar, but they make it in a different way from the other parts of…
Italy because the other ones don’t make tea. It’s not just cold different, it has a completely different taste.
Brian (12:26)
I
think you get that at Olive Garden, Anthony, isn’t that right?
⁓ no, I’m joking. I’m totally joking. No, I’m being facetious. I’m kind of making a point that that is completely unheard of. I mean, it’s something that nobody knows that you can go and have that, you know, let’s call it Italian food if there is a such a thing as Italian food. But that’s our idea. You know, you have these certain, you know, staple ideas about
Anthony (12:56)
From north to south, it’s all the same. they come and they ask me, Italian restaurant. We don’t have an Italian restaurant. What is restaurant?
Brian (13:03)
⁓
I was joking with somebody today at, know, trying to explain to my Italian friends that, you know, the American experience, when we go out to eat here in America, the conversation starts, what kind of food do you want? And then we start naming ethnicities or other countries, Mexican, do you want Thailand? You know, do you want Chinese? What kind of food in, you know, what kind of food do you want?
The conversation’s very different in Italy. What kind of food do you want? you want pasta, pizza, seafood, braised meats? You can have a slightly different experience in the same kind of genre, let’s say, under the canopy of Italian. But when we’re really eating local,
we’re eating something from that region and probably even more so something from that town, that village. And we’re talking about a very, very close proximity and they may have, you know, that thing, like what you’re talking about in Galleta, they may have that only there. so unless you visit there, you may never experience that. And so this becomes a whole new world for Americans coming over to understand
If I mean, yeah, I can find lasagna in Sicily. I’d rather go to Bologna and find Parmigiana Parmigiana in Bologna. I’d rather have it in Sicily. Yes. So, mean, you know, there’s there’s these things that you learn about Italian cuisine, if we can call it that food in Italy. And like you’re saying, this is this is a completely unknown ⁓ field for us to to venture into even talking about food. We haven’t talked.
so much about food on the podcast from time to time. So this is great that you do have the, whether Roman or Etruscan, I think you even mentioned a little bit ago before we started recording about Magna Graeca. And so you get this mix of eons of culture and language and, you know, food, all of this is impacted and you see that.
and it makes this incredible mosaic in Italy. Italy is a mosaic.
Anthony (15:28)
It
is, and it was a mosaic, and it was a mosaic that was then redone. It’s like having a puzzle and then destroying it and rebuilding it in different ways. So the borders of the region today are not the borders they used to be.
Brian (15:41)
Traditionally, okay.
Anthony (15:42)
And so you have an area which is more influenced by something and another area that now it’s within the same region that was influenced in a completely different way because they were invaded by different people, because they were under the influence of different dynasties, because for example, in the north of Rome we had the Etruscans and in the south we had the Greeks. And then the Romans took over.
Of course you have different influences in different layers. And then when it came together, then you have to put it, take into consideration the fact that all this was not just deleted. It stays there and a layer itself. And this makes the culture, which for me, it’s so fascinating because by looking at even the food, you can sort of trace back where it comes from. and.
Brian (16:32)
Well,
lot of Sicilian food has roots in the Arab era that was there. And you trace that back and it’s lovely and beautiful and can be right. And that you can find in Olive Garden is an orange. But I’m joking again. It’s something that’s replicated, but you don’t have that authentic experience until you have it there. so talking about Lazio, as I understand from you, you look at Lazio in really two
parts. Talk to us about that.
Anthony (17:05)
So Rome is in the middle, is exactly in between these two parts. So the north of Lazio, I would go to and I go to because of its beautiful Renaissance villas, because of its hillside. The landscape is, say, in comparison, similar to Tuscany. They are the largest producers of hazelnuts for any product you can buy also in the United States.
They have some of the best olive oil. It’s not only in Tuscany. Extremely good olive oil is in ⁓ Viterbo and around Viterbo, because it’s a volcanic area. There is marble, there is peperino, there is a variety of products, not only food, but also stones, also ⁓ villas of ⁓ cardinals and pope.
and their families are located there because it is fascinating. So I like to take my children to see these places. For example, in the north of Latium, I would go, that’s my heart, that’s where my heart lies. So I have to talk about it. I go to Viterbo. It’s a medieval city. It’s tiny, yet not that small. You can still go out and see different things for two, three days.
There is the papal palace, there is the place where the pope was elected, and then you have very close, like 30 minutes drive, you are in a fantastic residence from the Renaissance. And then there is a villa, Villa L’Ante, which was elected to have the most beautiful gardens in Italy. It’s incredible. And it was the hunting retreat of some cardinals.
Or you can go to Bomarzo. Bomarzo was a garden called also the Garden of Monsters that was gifted by a Prince Orsini to his wife, Giulia Farnese, in her honor. And you walk around these bushes, this forest almost, and you bump into sculptures that are monstrous. So you can enter in the mouth of a monster, you can see a house which is a bit tilted.
It’s unexpected and fascinating. But if you head towards the coast, then you see sights from the Etruscans. So you can visit Tarquinia, for example. can go… The town is medieval with towers, but then you go further out and there are incredible Etruscan tombs.
There are three villages in a row, ⁓ Sorano, Sovana and Pitigliano. And one has Etruscan tombs, another one is called the little Jerusalem for its Jewish ghetto. Another one has incredible views and it’s mostly from the Middle Ages. Everywhere you can take day trips or you can spend a weekend or even a week just exploring that area. And every site is different.
Brian (20:31)
Let’s
talk about that for just a second. Anthony, maybe you can speak to this. know, we have folks that come over. Rome can be, how do I say this? Rome can be a little jarring, ⁓ rough and rowdy, you know, depending, you know, a lot of our clients will either start or end their trips in Rome. Maybe the other side of that would be a Venice or a Milan. ⁓ But, you know, by contrast, Rome,
⁓ It’s kind of, you know, like a Naples, it can be overwhelming to some. There’s so much to do and see. I mean, you could go back dozens of times and still have so much more to see and understand and absorb about Rome. so it will always have its value. It is the eternal city. Okay. That said, sometimes you need to get out. Sometimes a little day trip.
will help to reset, take a breather, going to one of these hilltop villages. You may not be in Tuscany, but you are experiencing something very similar, really close to Rome. It’s doable. ⁓ A little weekend away, that kind of thing. How does that help? And where would you put that in an itinerary to go and do an experience like what Eva is talking about?
Anthony (21:59)
Yeah, mean, what happens is, and customers, they’ve got to go to Rome, right? And you’ve got to land there, first of all. It’s either Milan, Rome, or Venice, really, for the shortest trips. obviously, Rome is the city that everyone wants to land in, get their jet lag, go see the highlights, and then get me to the hilltops of Tuscany. Then get me to the, maybe even the caves of Ovieto and Ombria, right?
But it’s a knowledge thing, right? To convince or to make people understand what they have on their checklist. And their checklist is Tuscany with the Cypress trees. It’s the wine, it’s the olive oil, it’s the truffles, it’s Florence, right? So I think what happens is it all comes down to ⁓ how do we serve them well knowing that, hey, I can get you the hilltop town. I can get you the Etruscan caves. I can get you the olive oil and the food you’re looking for.
⁓ It doesn’t have to be Tuscany. That’s part of our job is what we do. ⁓ And I think it’s more or less people have these check boxes, right? So my thing is to educate our customers that why would you have to go where the tourists are, the crowds are when you have it, you have Renaissance, you have the Etruscan history, you have the antiquity, you have the food that you’re looking for in the Lachio region itself and not have to go up to Tuscany.
Brian (23:27)
without
the crowds, a little bit cheaper. I mean, there’s so many pluses.
Anthony (23:27)
about the
They’re right near Umbria, so you can do both.
Brian (23:33)
People don’t know what they don’t know. that comes into where a guide like Eva is invaluable to us in helping to inform us so we can inform our guests of what to look for and how to get what they’re… Like you said, there is that magical picture in their minds that won’t go away until they go and take that selfie at the Coliseum.
or in Positano and you’re like, okay, why are you going to spend seven days in Positano? Are you crazy? know, so it learning, learning to understand what are they really after? Okay. If you need to go get that out of your system and go do that selfie, do it, but let us show you the real experience that I think is going to meet a deeper desire that they have.
Anthony (24:21)
I think it’s the point of Americans have FOMO, the fear of missing out. They do. They have this fear of… Yeah, I understand it’s on a hill. I understand it’s Renaissance and it’s a palace. it’s not the Duomo of Florence. And that’s the biggest thing I get out of it. And I can tell you, when we put someone in Umbria, we put someone in, you know, Ischia, instead of Amalfi, we put someone in, they appreciate it.
Brian (24:33)
But it’s not
It wasn’t in the film.
Anthony (24:51)
and they’re glad the Taurus on
Brian (24:52)
I think at first they’re a little disappointed because it’s not trending on TikTok at the moment. so then how do they, know, that fear of missing out. There’s a trust issue there.
Anthony (25:04)
The factor, you know. Yeah, that’s a big, big But
I love the idea of ⁓ what Ava’s saying is, you know, it comes to our knowledge too, our comfort level, right? That’s what we do. We go to these places, we entrust our partners when they give us, you know, these itineraries and these ideas of what to do. And to have someone like an Ava, all right, we’re leaving Rome now, guys. Guess what? We’re gonna go to the hilltop. I guess we’ll go. We’re going to Viterbo.
And then over there, she’s gonna take your kids to this monster forest. Because your kids wanna be out in the woods and they wanna do nature, right? You know what mean? That’s the things that we can speak to. then you’ll say, well, that’s a fantastic idea. Or you can go walk around in a town that has millions of people that speak English and you’ll have that hilltop view and go to the, you know, stand in line and go to this palace that everyone else goes to. So it’s an educational piece and it’s also the ability for
Brian (25:40)
Yeah.
Anthony (26:02)
a customer to be open minded, right? Because I’ll tell you now, 25 years from now, Viterbo, 20 years from now is gonna be the new Quattona. You know what I’m saying? That’s what’s gonna happen. You agree? If someone talks about it, yes. Our Instagram talks about it. For instance, you talked about the places that they see, for example, Palazzo Farnese in Caprarola is in many movies. You don’t know. They don’t say that it’s Caprarola. say it’s Vatican. It’s not in the Vatican.
Brian (26:10)
Right?
but no one
Hahaha
Anthony (26:32)
It’s out of Rome. It’s not the Vati. we have close to Rome, we have a lake that is beautiful. And if you want to go around the lake, you can also swim in the lake. I go there over the weekend when it’s summer. In Bracciano? in Bracciano. There is a beautiful castle, a huge castle of the Orsini family. Or for example, you can go to the lake of Nemi and eat the little local strawberries.
and they have the museum of boats. So there was a Roman emperor that had two boats in this lake and then they were drowned. Um, Caligula. So these boats, let’s not talk about Caligula right now. 2000 years ago, right? put an what do call it? X rating. He was staying there chilling. Are you talking about huge boats? Now years ago,
Brian (27:16)
Something I don’t remember
What was he doing in the boats?
Anthony (27:30)
A portion of a marble floor of this boat was found in New York. There was a guy that had published a book about marbles and this lady walked by and said, that looks a whole lot like my coffee table. It was her coffee table. So you see things that are unexpected, but do happen.
Now it’s back where it should be. anyway, also there is the people residents at the Roman castles. You can have wine tastings. There are a lot of producers, wine producers around the hilltops of Rome. There is a palace. So even if you try and think that why did these emperors, why did these nobles, ⁓ huge important families have their residences on the hilltops around Rome?
And why aren’t you interested in seeing them? I mean, if they went there, it’s going to be something nice. Tivoli, there is a humongous villa of Adrian. You can spend a day there just walking, experience, breathing it in. He had a little residence surrounded by water when he wanted to just be isolated or you can go to Villa d’Este, which was the model for the gardens of Versailles. And it’s doable in…
You go in the morning, you come back in the evening. So you don’t have to miss out on anything, but why do you want to six hours hating people around you? In line. In line, waiting, being treated poorly, shouting, not being able to go where you want to go. What’s going to happen if you don’t enter inside the Colosseum and just see it from the outside? I’ve asked myself, really, what would change if I don’t go?
Brian (29:04)
Waiting
Anthony (29:21)
to time square. What happens?
Brian (29:25)
Right. It’s that FOMO. It is. It’s that, yeah, getting that. It’s the picture. Because you got it burned into your brain. But I think this is what’s so great. mean, you know, we’ve talked about the, for me at least, the diversity of Italy is one thing that makes it so beautiful. Like you said, a mosaic, a picture that’s been broken in a million pieces and put back together probably multiple times because of Sicily in particular, how many times it’s been conquered, all over Italy in general.
Anthony (29:31)
I gotta get the picture, I gotta get the t-shirt.
Brian (29:55)
feels like that and you have the diversity of, you know, five kilometers away, it changes. That, that in itself makes Italy inexhaustible as a place to come back and visit. But like we’ve said so many times, without somebody to take you and you see it through their lens in, its proper context, historically, and how the locals
function, what does that feel like? You know, some of our guests have come over and they asked me, I was traveling around with them in Sicily and they’re, let’s stop at a, not a supermarket, at the mall. Let’s stop at the Centro Comerciale. And I’m like, that is, we’re here in the Valley of Temples in Agrigento. Why would you? But it’s, for them, it’s an experience of…
I want to know what it’s like on the local level. What do the local people do? What do they look, what do they go after? What do they eat? What do they, know, they want that. That’s immersion. And it’s hard to get that without somebody to introduce you to it. So again, you know, our friends coming over here to the U S from Italy, having us take them downtown Nashville to the honky tonks to Broadway, to, know, the kind of, it’s the iconic feel and the, the immersive experience.
That is so meaningful, especially when you’re with somebody from there who can interpret what you’re seeing. And I think that’s what makes ⁓ Eva and her team, our guides, so invaluable to us is they’re interpreters, not for the language, so much for the culture and what it means and why it’s important. And I can look at a painting all day long and I know nothing about art.
Anthony (31:23)
Perfectly said,
Brian (31:46)
but if I have somebody just in 30 seconds explain why it’s important, I can appreciate it and enjoy it. And now it’s got a place in my heart.
Anthony (31:54)
Yeah, and I think it’s funny because we just had one of our colleagues, Laura, come back from Florence. And first time she went to Florence, it was crowded. She didn’t like it, right? Now she just came back and it’s January and it was quiet. It was more of a local feel. And she went with the local people, met our local partners and guides. And it was a special, it was more special to her. Now she likes it. I don’t know she loves it, but she likes it. ⁓ But it is, it is a little different.
See, my impression, when I want someone to go to Italy, I want them to have those moments where they’re with a local, such as in Ava, and it’s a place that no one else knows about, and you’re talking about it to your friends, and you’re explaining it to them, and they never heard it. It’s like their own little, it’s their own little hideaway, you know what mean, that they’ve been to.
I got a question though, is the personality, Romans, you know how Romans are? I’m not gonna bash you guys. they, know, the center of the universe and I’m Roman. As a matter of fact, when I talk to my friends, I get a good segue to what I’m asking. The local Roman here, he’s born and raised in Rome, he lives here in Nashville. And I’m like, all right, I’m gonna do a presentation on Lazio. Do you want to help me do the presentation? Because we have an Italian group here. He goes,
What Lachio? There’s Rome and nothing else. What are you talking about? What about Gaeta? What about… And he’s like, no, there’s Rome. So what is the personality or the heartbeat of the people outside of the eternal city itself? I just give an example that happened today. I came here into this registration studio. I took a picture of it and sent it to a friend whose husband
⁓ works in the sound system. So it was a picture of him and she sent me back a picture of Civita di Bagnoreggio because they had gone to Civita di Bagnoreggio for the day. For the day. then she sent me another picture of the lake of Nemi with the sunset. And it’s something that Romans do. when I don’t go to the city center.
I have to admit, some of my friends say, oh, do you want to go to the city center in the weekend? I’m like, the weekend? No. The city center? You nuts? No. Get me out, don’t get me in. I live in the outskirts of Rome. And it’s quiet and it’s nice. It’s pleasant. And we do have art close by. mean, in 10 minutes, I’m in the place where St. Paul was beheaded.
There is so much around where we are. We just need, I don’t know, 20 minutes to reach a site to visit. So I like that. Some Romans have never been, most Romans have never been to the Vatican museums, have never been inside the Colosseum. Now I’m an exception because I’ve always been a museum nerd and a history. ⁓
and ⁓ mythology. So I was always inside museums and the Museum of Boats. I remember when my father went to pick up my mother, we had a couple hours to wait around. I would always go to a museum. I wanted to see things, but it interferes with me. example, Trastevere, it’s a neighborhood that I love, but it’s starting to bother me because
this fact that it’s authentic, it’s authentic, that’s where the Romans live. Now the Romans don’t live there anymore. First of all, they can’t afford it. Secondly, they want to sleep any day of the week. It’s too loud. There are two or three American universities. cannot, the most authentic place is where they would not go. It’s Via Margute, it’s quiet. There is no one there. And it’s in between People’s Square and the Spanish Steps. But again, the feeling of…
Romans, they rarely go to the city center. It’s a city that is starting not to belong to them and being so big and hard to get around when you live out, we hardly enjoy it. If you live in the city center, you can enjoy the city center. If you live in the outskirts, it’s hard because it takes you an hour to go in and an hour to park the car. And then you have to walk for miles and miles is one thing that I noticed here. You park right in front of where you need to go or you keep looking for.
Half an hour. We are happy. I’m amazed. We can park five miles away and we’re very happy. So probably the fact that it has become so hard doesn’t make us use, let’s say, our city or take advantage of the city or enjoy it because it’s not enjoyable anymore.
Brian (37:03)
That’s interesting. I’d love to zoom back out again, because we’ve kind of done this. We’ve zoomed out, we zoomed back in, we zoomed, let’s zoom out again. You’ve talked to us through the upper part of Lazio, the high part of Lazio.
She’s rubbing her hands together. Okay, goody, goody, goody. Let’s go to, but before we close this out, I want to get to the south, the lower part of Lazio. Describe that for us, because there’s a little bit of contrast here.
Anthony (37:34)
Yeah, so in the south, instead of the Trescans, because the Trescans were not there, basically they almost stopped around Rome area, so one side of the river. And in the south, you have ⁓ ancient Roman architecture, of course, have Minturno, which is extremely fascinating. But what I like the most is the villages by the sea. So one of the most beautiful
I don’t say it, it’s written in books. It’s in the list of the most beautiful villages of Italy. There is Sperlonga. You gotta have good legs, I have to admit, because it’s so on top of a cliff. A lot of walking, A lot of walking. But it is a very beautiful village. I wouldn’t go there in July or August, because it’s packed with Romans that go somewhere near. But the sea is beautiful.
⁓ The village is fascinating. You don’t any guidance about the monuments. You can just stroll around. can stroll with a local. So you can go with a tour leader and just stroll around, get some explanations about the food, about the bars, about the little restaurants. You can go and visit the Villa of Tiberias. can go to Gaeta in Ida Tiela, the medieval neighborhood.
And then a place that I adore is Anagni. Anagni is fascinating for a historian like me. There is a chapel, it’s entirely fresco, it’s called the Medieval Sistine Chapel. Definitely worth a visit. And the palace of Bonifax VIII. was the pope that dented, hated, he hated Bonifax VIII.
Brian (39:25)
I him in his book, I think. I forget what level of hell he was at.
Anthony (39:27)
Hahaha
He mentioned the Pope before him, said, because this Pope resigned, said, hadn’t he resigned, this one that is terrible would not have become Pope. You can go and visit the castle of Fumone, which is actually property of a guy, a colleague of mine. That’s where was imprisoned a Pope, Pope that… Not your friend.
No, the one before, the one that… No, not my friend. It was a while ago. I’m not that old. ⁓ It’s just so different. North is more hilly. The south is starting to… It’s more beachy, more relaxing. You can go to Fuji. It’s a spa.
Brian (40:10)
The feel is different.
Anthony (40:24)
and take half a day off and just relax.
Brian (40:29)
Is that where a lot of Romans go to escape the city life? They’re going to head to the south of Lazio
Anthony (40:35)
to
the beaches we go to the south of Lazio. Absolutely. So would you recommend that for a customer, say I got a customer I want to go to a Malfi even though Positano is a lot of walking as you know up and down the steps ⁓ would you say no no no go here and spend three or four days here take a boat ride enjoy the beaches so that is a great alternative possibly for a Malfi. Yes so let’s say that I would skip a Malfi completely. I would go to the north of it.
or south of it. So it depends on how much time they want to dedicate to this. But of course, ⁓ Santa Maria di Gassalla Bate, ⁓ acciaroli as I said, and you have pestum, so with the Greek ruins, that is definitely worth a visit. not touristy. the mozzarella. I’m like those in Torrents, say that.
I just love it. Oh, but you know that there is mozzarella, buffalo mozzarella also in Lazio. It’s very typical from Latina. So on your way down to Gaeta, you can actually stop and have mozzarella. I didn’t think about it before. This is one thing that I do. I change my mind during tours as well. So I’m like, oh, we’re going there. And then I changed my mind and go, no, we’re actually not going there because before I need to show you. me, by the way, a couple of times. Was it worth it? Yes, it was. But you’ve done that.
Except for the gluten free chocolate gelato place that you took me to. What was it? it’s raw. You had to try it because it’s unique. have, I have with you. It’s raw. Everything raw. Yeah, that’s what it was. Okay.
Brian (42:16)
There’s so much that we could delve into. There’s so much contrast, there’s so much diversity, and there’s so many things to think about that people could do. if you’ve been listening to all this, no doubt you have your brain full. You’ve been drinking from the fire hose here of information. ⁓ You know, I think the bottom line to kind of sum up some of our thoughts today, Rome is beautiful, it’s wonderful.
It can be a lot and overwhelming and especially if you’re fighting with the crowds, it might do you some good to get out and to see Lazio. Yeah, it’s not the thing that’s on everybody’s bucket list, but as you’ve heard today, there are things that probably should be on your bucket list and now you have to put them in the lineup and it makes sense because it’s so close to Rome.
Anthony (43:14)
sorry, I forgot one thing I really, really wanted to say. So on your way from or to the airport, there is the first colony of ancient Rome. It’s called ancient Austria.
Brian (43:26)
That’s a great, great thing to end with here.
Anthony (43:28)
You
don’t need to go to Pompeii and not even to the Colosseum because Rome is about the great things. It’s like the greatest building of this, the greatest palace of that. But if you want to see how Romans really lived very close to Rome and you can reach even with public transport, it’s very easy. You can go to Inchenostia and you perfectly get the feel of it.
Brian (43:38)
Texas
Anthony (43:57)
The fascinating thing is that you can visit the rooms, there is a theater, there is the square, there are the thermal baths, multiple thermal baths. You can see the cafeteria, you can see the bakery, and it’s clear. And then from there, you can go and eat at the medieval neighborhood, the little village that was born from the ashes of the Roman one, and there is also fortress. You can spend a beautiful day and relaxing without having to rush up and down to make it on time to spend one hour and a half in Pompeii.
driving six hours.
Brian (44:28)
And then you’re already at Fiumicino and you can take your flight out or whatever, do that on your way in. And you have an experience like that without standing in the bizarre lines and everything. All that, let’s just, I want to underline one thing before we wrap up. And that is a lot of people hearing news and watching things that are going on in Italy and Rome in particular this year, the Jubilee, Jubileo.
in Rome, a lot of people are scared to come over because they, okay, the crowds are gonna be, you know, what are they saying? So many million people more than. There’s a million people walking around. So it was ridiculous before to stand in line to go to this place or the other, it’s even more, it’s even worse now. How do you see the situation? We’re here.
Anthony (45:07)
certain days in general.
Brian (45:21)
in or already a month into the new year, what are you actually seeing?
Anthony (45:26)
I can give you my opinion and then I can give you the official numbers. So my opinion has been for a while that given all the advertising about the crowds, about the work in progress, about the traffic, a lot of people were going to bail out. So I wasn’t expecting a lot. Presses had gone, had skyrocketed. They opened five star plus hotels. Fears have gone up and I thought,
that wasn’t going to work also because pilgrims and then she are not all going to travel in Bulgari. So I saw it dark and then the official numbers came that the residences that are managed by the Vatican, they’re full. The Vatican has reserved a lot of tickets for pilgrims. So it’s going to be hard getting admission tickets. They’re probably going to cost a lot more, but hotels are empty.
Brian (46:25)
and
Anthony (46:25)
So
like an unexpected rate is about 30 % less. It’s an estimate than last year.
Brian (46:34)
Wow. Interesting. That’s going to have an impact. That’s interesting to know for our guests. I think, know, to kind of sum that part up, you’ve got two options and that’s to come over to Rome. If you’re scared about the crowds that maybe actually don’t exist, you’ve got Lazio and you’ve got some great, great options. Thank you, Eva, for being on the show today and sharing.
this wealth of information with us and with our listeners. What a ⁓ great resource and great partner. Thank you for being one of our go-to people. And you have been for years for the pulse of what’s actually happening in the tourism industry in Italy. That is incredible ⁓ value here.
Anthony (47:24)
And I must say, Ava’s partner who’s a good friend and love him to death is ⁓ Master Pizzami.
Brian (47:32)
That, ⁓ that- ⁓ You need
a whole episode on that.
Anthony (47:36)
You
really want to get outside of Rome and try a great pasta or pizza experience. We have a great partnership with him. The passion, the fun you have with him and he’s outside. Like she’s just saying, it’s what 20 minutes outside? Three. You’re like 20, 25 minutes outside. Yeah. So I just want to say that. So it’s a little plug, but it’s not just a little plug. But you are outside of city center. trying to wrap this up. But I want to wrap that up with that because I think it’s funny. Giuseppe is the best. So I think it’s worth saying. Thank you so much.
Truly been precious working with you for so many years and I’m very, very excited about how it is evolving. I’m so happy to be here, not only recording, but to be here, here. In Nashville, Tennessee. In Nashville with you. So thank you. Thank you. can’t wait to see you in line dancing tonight.
Brian (48:27)
That’s right, Boots, scoot, and boogie.
Anthony (48:29)
We’ll get that on the- we’ll get that on the Instagram channel. Please no! ⁓
Brian (48:33)
Yeah. All
right, guys, until next time. Arrivederci. Arrivederci. Arrivederci. Ciao. Ciao, ⁓
Anthony (48:39)
See you
