Mastering the Italian Travel Experience | Planning

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Episode summary

In this episode of the Bella Italy podcast, hosts Brian and AC discuss the theme of Season Four, which focuses on traveling well in Italy.

They explore the complexities of the Italian travel experience, emphasizing the importance of planning and overcoming the overwhelm that often accompanies travel preparation. The conversation delves into the nuances of building itineraries, the significance of choosing the right accommodations, and the challenges posed by information overload in the digital age.

Through their insights, they aim to equip listeners with the knowledge needed to navigate Italy’s diverse regions and enjoy a fulfilling travel experience. In this conversation, the hosts discuss the importance of planning ahead for travel, particularly when visiting Italy.

They emphasize the need for authentic experiences, cost management, and understanding local logistics to enhance the travel experience. The conversation also touches on the stress of travel and the overwhelming amount of information available, suggesting that working with experts can alleviate some of that burden.

Episode Transcript

Brian Alex (00:01)
And we are back around again. We are live, live recording. And I’m getting the text that it’s the audio quality is higher than normal. I don’t know what that means. We’re such novices here. I guess that’s good. Higher than normal. Ooh, piece of candy. Going from poor to normal. So hey, welcome back around again.

AC (00:06)
Yes.

Yes, which poor, going from poor to normal is good, so yes.

For all our listeners, you’re lucky. Go ahead.

Brian Alex (00:31)
You lucked out on this episode. have higher quality than normal. I mean, we may actually get into some substance on this particular episode. We have been told, and I’ll just throw this out there at the beginning, we have been told, don’t listen to those guys. They don’t talk about anything. Their show’s about nothing. And I say, we are in good company because we are the Seinfeld of Italy Travel.

AC (00:55)
Yes.

Brian Alex (00:59)
A show about nothing, so there you go, welcome back. man, no, it stung a bit. We’re gonna try to come up with some substance here just to prove him wrong, or her, whoever it was, however they identify, we don’t know. But anyway, before we digress,

AC (01:01)
Yes, yes. You can call me George because I’m bald. Yes. That one hurt. That one hurt though.

Yes, yes, I think it was a her. Yes, it was her.

Brian Alex (01:26)
Let’s move forward and welcome back around again guys. Thanks for tuning in to another episode of the Bella Italy podcast. As you no doubt are aware, we are ankle deep in season four here. We had a good two rounds, two episodes talking about nothing. We actually rehearsed a little bit of what’s…

AC (01:48)
That’s not true, but go ahead. I

feel bad.

Brian Alex (01:51)
what’s

been going on in the last six months and got everybody caught up, up to speed on what’s been happening and where we’ve been going, what we’ve been seeing, kind of the vibe, the feel over here in Italy and traveling over here. I think that’s why people tune in. I hope it is, I guess it is, I don’t know. Why are you, leave a comment, somebody please tell us why you’re actually tuning in. Have we gotten any feedback on that?

AC (02:16)
I think people tune in.

Yeah, I think people tune in because customers do, or clients and people that just listen to podcasts, they’ll tell us, listen to it, honesty, our rapport with each other, and we tell the truth. Or a lot of times, if you listen to an Italian podcast or an Italy travel podcast, it’s a lot of fluff. Not fluff, but it’s about the travel and everything’s wonderful. We kind of can tell you both sides, because we are Italian, living in Italy, I mean, it helps.

Brian Alex (02:41)
We’re anti-fluff.

Anti-fluff. actually… We’re trying not to throw Italy under the bus. That’s my thing. Anyway, yeah, all fluffy vibes. no, so we’ve spent two episodes talking about our theme, I think, on this. Every birthday has a theme. How do you not know that?

AC (02:44)
Exactly. Why the heck am I going to Italy? I have to talk to these guys. No.

So it’s going to be positive from here on. Go ahead.

Brian Alex (03:09)
Every podcast has a theme every season. The theme this season, season four, is traveling well here in Italy. you know, Italy is its own worst enemy when it comes to travel. It is a little dysfunctional at the bureaucratic level. It can be disorienting. There are tons of regions that are not

really user friendly, not travel friendly. And so when we talk about traveling well over here, hopefully people are coming away with a little sense of what does it feel like, look like, what is it like to travel in Italy? What do they need to know the things to do, not do all of that kind of stuff? And so in this episode, we’re going to kick off a little bit of a mini series inside of the season where we’re gonna use a couple of templates, a couple of

building blocks to itineraries as backdrops to which we can build on top of those a couple of principles a couple of foundational pillars the the seven pillars of traveling well in Italy ooh doesn’t that sound lofty yeah take that you who say we talk about nothing what about the seven pillars all right

AC (04:22)
by Brian Covey. Deep. I’m going to write that one down. Coming to

a Marriott near you. OK, let’s move on, Brian. Yes.

Brian Alex (04:34)
we’re going to make big bucks off of this one. This free podcast episode. OK, anyway, no monetization at all going on here. No.

So all that to say, you know, we in our 30 plus years of traveling over here in Italy and living here in Italy, we’ve learned a couple of things. The hard way, I’ll say not always, you know.

AC (05:01)
Mm.

Brian Alex (05:04)
learning without any bumps and bruises along the way. School of Hard Knocks, that’s our alma mater. And so hopefully we can share a little bit of, I wouldn’t call it wisdom, but let’s say knowledge with folks tuning in. so, all right, let’s start. This time around, we’re just gonna start with a basic template. This is, for those of you just tuning in that don’t know us, Brian and Anthony here, we are colleagues on

a team, an agency that Anthony is the owner, operator, president, CEO, CFO and COO of. His wife really runs the company. Denise, shout out to Denise. You are the Putin of this particular enterprise. But all that to say, yeah, we…

AC (05:49)
I’m just a puppet because Yes company yes

Brian Alex (06:02)
Behind the scenes, pulling the strings, if you will, or if you won’t, is Italy with Bella. So check us out online anytime, italywithbellah.com. That’s the travel agency that we’re a part of. this podcast is really just an expression of that, you know, our love for Italy, our history, our background, our roots here. All of that comes into just, hey, we gotta express ourselves, we gotta talk about Italy.

AC (06:30)
Mm.

Brian Alex (06:31)
We gotta get, you know, get this out there kind of thing. And so we enjoy, that’s why we do it. We just enjoy talking about it, Ali. So, right?

AC (06:39)
I

think what it is is our passion for it, our love for our people, the country, the culture. And the reason we have Italy with Bella is because to experience it well, to experience it right way, not to go through the frustration that you go through day to day, Brian, living there, right? Or even traveling there myself. So that’s the reason we brought up Italy with Bella is because we, and the podcast, because we want people to travel well and experience it the way you should experience it. So yeah, exactly.

Brian Alex (07:06)
Right.

Yeah, and a lot of the suffering, if I can say it like that, or the school of hard knocks, learning the difficult way, it’s just plain ignorance. A lot of what I’ve learned in living here in this country in more than a decade and traveling for more than 30 years is just, shoot, I shouldn’t have done it that way, that was stupid. Or not knowing the rules or…

AC (07:17)
Hmm.

Brian Alex (07:33)
not observing the traffic signs or not realizing the currency exchange rate or any myriad of different things and learning, okay, ouch, that hurt, don’t do that again, right?

AC (07:47)
Yeah, it happens. I think you and I just traveled and I think it happened. Well, that was a first. I you just looked at each other like, we haven’t seen that, you know, and you still learn every time you go. It could be by a region or a culture, cultural difference. Being in Abruzzo, then it might be in Sicily. We still learn those things. And surprisingly, how many, how long we’ve lived, traveled and been there, it’s still things that we learn. Exactly.

Brian Alex (08:07)
Yeah, and that’s a big point is that in the 20 regions that we have here, they are drastically different. Even inside of the regions, and I live in one of the largest regions in Italy, Sicily. And in Sicily, we are drastically different town to town. Five kilometers away, the dialect changes, it shifts subtly, the accent, what they eat is different. All of that kind of thing goes into making the experience, which is…

You know, it has its pluses and its minuses, its advantage, disadvantage, because I love the diversity here in Italy. mean, you can never get tired of being in Italy because every town you go to is a different experience. But that also, you know, factors into some of the challenge of it is, it’s not as homogenous as a lot of.

United States cookie cutter towns walk into a Walmart You already know automatically where everything is because that you know, you’ve been to one you’ve been to them all and you know how it works It’s it’s not necessarily like that here. And so there’s a lot to learn and keep learning here with regards to Italy so That said coming back around We’re gonna take a couple of templates a couple of just building blocks of normal itineraries. I don’t know how many times I’ve been asked

AC (09:05)
Agree. Agree.

Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (09:32)
Brian, you live in Italy, you’ve been traveling there for years. This is my first time, where should I go? And I’m like, how the heck should I know? What do you want? What do you wanna eat? What do you wanna see? What do you wanna do? How much Instagram and TikTok? Have you been influenced by how many bloggers are pulling strings in your head and getting it right off to this, that, and the other? Okay, so all that factors into, it’s very subjective.

AC (09:40)
Exactly.

How many days? Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (09:59)
And, you know, a lot of times on the business side, you know, Italy with Bella, what we do for a living, we do factor in, okay, their particular nuances of who they are, what they want, what they’re after, the kind of experience, etc. But there are some basic itinerary building blocks that, you know, will come away, especially for first timers. You’ve never been to Italy.

Okay, gosh, you got to see Rome. I mean, it’s like there’s just nothing that compares and probably a Florence and then you’ve got to consider either Venice or a Milan and and you know, it’s it’s not just What are those building blocks that you’re gonna put down and then lay, know as kind of a foundation? But then the experience that you’re after because each of those is very different as we’re talking about I mean those are draft drastically different experiences

AC (10:33)
Hmm.

Brian Alex (10:57)
But then you’re also talking about the entrance into the country and your exit going out of the country. What does that look like for international flights, etc. There’s tons of considerations when you’re coming in and leaving. It’s not necessarily like a lot of Italians tell me. I went to the United States and I can guess already, you know, where did you go? I went to…

I went to New York, I just went to New York and I came back. Okay, great, well how was that? You didn’t really see America, but okay, it was a first step, it was great. Or maybe they did Miami, maybe they did LA. They have kind of the usual suspects in the lineup, which is fine, and that’s your first experience, but it’s not where everybody lives. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it’s not where the normal Joe lives.

AC (11:29)
Hmm.

It’s the same thing as America and Italy. It’s what’s most popular on Instagram.

It’s what they know. Pizza, Rome, Naples, whatever. It’s just what they see and what they know. And Italians are the same way, surprisingly. And their impression when they come back is what? I know America. I’ve been to Times Square. So it’s kind of that vibe. agree.

Brian Alex (12:05)
Right.

Yeah, yes. And you’re the Michael Scott eating the Manhattan style pizza, the Sbarro, in Times Square. Yeah, you’ve done great. Okay, you’ve tasted America. Now you can go home. All right. So anyway, here we go. We’re looking at a couple of these just, you know, foundational.

AC (12:16)
Sparrows.

Brian Alex (12:33)
building blocks to putting an itinerary together. We’re talking about coming into Rome or you you can even reverse this but whichever way you want to do it. Rome, maybe a smaller hilltop town something like a Cortona. You could do you know there’s tons of places to go and to see around in in Tuscany, Orezzo or Florence. Okay then you hit Florence because it’s just

idyllic, it’s just this other world, right? And then your exit, maybe you’re looking, maybe you stop over in Bologna and then you head out of Venice. Let’s just say that. So you’ve got this kind of trek. You come into Rome and you head north and you’re on the road. We’re talking several hours if you were to drive it all together, seven hours from Rome to Venice, for example. And that’s a lot to take in.

And so you’re chopping up your trip, you’re staying over a few nights here and there along your way and you’re getting different experiences. You’re kind of getting a framework for what living in Italy looks like, what visiting and eating and just the normal vibe in different towns and how things are different. You’re getting all of that. To make this successful though, there are some things that you need to know and some principles you need to apply.

And so in the next couple of episodes, we’re gonna start getting into some of these principles, if you will. And the first one is just so utterly, you know, basic, like this itinerary, going from Rome to Venice. It’s so utterly basic, but it’s basic for a reason. It is, you know, as we’ve talked about in the past, the road more often traveled going from Rome to Venice.

It’s more traveled for a reason because it’s tried and true. It’s proven. It has value. It gives a great experience, especially if it’s your first time over. And so what we’re putting on top of this here and the principle that we’re talking about is planning. Planning sounds so basic. It sounds so fundamental. Who doesn’t plan? Funnily enough, over on…

The business side, a lot of the folks that come to us, and this isn’t just a plug, we’re just using this as comparison, a lot of the folks that come to us say that they’re overwhelmed with all the details of planning. I mean, that’s probably the number one reason that we see folks coming over to Italy with Bella.

AC (15:05)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I think the number one reason is overwhelmed. And a lot of people don’t use travel agents, right? They don’t use people that design trips. And the reason they call a Bella or another travel agent that specializes only in Italy is because of being overwhelmed and worrying about culture, worried about real experience, worried about language. Never been overseas, don’t understand trains because we live in America. We don’t use trains often. So there’s an overwhelming…

thing for a lot of people and what I mean by that is they’re used to booking their Disney, they’re used to booking their cruises, they’re going to Vegas, they’re to go the national parks, right? They book it. They’ll use their own trip app, they’ll spend the time and the hours looking up stuff on YouTube, but soon as they start unfolding and start looking on Instagram and start realizing, what’s this Amalfi Coast? What’s this, Rome? I saw this cave restaurant in Puglia, I saw this in Venice, and then it’s a can of worms.

Right? the opera? I didn’t know I can write a Ferrari. it’s just like, all right, now what do I do? I’m not only overwhelmed because my cousin’s saying I need to go here. My friend who went four times as an expert in Italy and says you need to go to, you know, Luca. And all of sudden you have all this overwhelming peace, not just from the culture, the language and the traveling there and logistics. But now you’re overwhelmed. What the heck do I do? I only got eight days, 10 days, 11 days. How do I squeeze it into that bag?

Brian Alex (16:37)
Mm-hmm.

AC (16:39)
How do I squeeze those particular things that my cousins, Instagram and everything’s telling me where to go, overwhelming is probably the biggest thing. Even on our website it says most customers just overwhelmed and that is the biggest thing. And they’re, like I said, they’re be overwhelmed because they’re scared, they’re overwhelmed because they don’t wanna spend all this money and have a good experience, right? Or they’re overwhelmed because they have people that are relying on them and they’re worried that they’re not gonna plan it. Or they’re overwhelmed because the window’s too short. We’re gonna talk about that too. They’re overwhelmed like, they’re going in May and it’s November right now. That’s overwhelmed too.

Brian Alex (17:01)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

AC (17:09)
So definitely the biggest reason we get calls.

Brian Alex (17:10)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

And I wonder if that’s kind of a sign of our of the times, a sign of the age that we live in where we have we are overwhelmed with so many options. You literally can, you know, open up TikTok, Instagram, whatever Facebook and whatever platform you want and immediately get a little bit overwhelmed with the amount of choices, options.

AC (17:25)
Mm-hmm. That’s good.

Brian Alex (17:39)
so many businesses, many restaurants, so many tours and museums and churches and whatever to see and do over here are now online and easily accessible. And so it’s not, it’s not for lack of information that people come to, you know, a company like Italy with Bella, but really the overwhelm of information, which is really odd. It used to be so different years ago.

AC (17:48)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (18:05)
You would actually search when the internet was, the dew of creation was still fresh on the internet. You would go and you would search for what are the top 10 things to do in X, name that city. Nowadays, you have no shortage of that. In fact, you’ve got debates going on and there’s strings being pulled to whatever revenue source and click throughs and click backs and SEO and everything.

AC (18:20)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (18:35)
that it’s really hard to tell who’s actually got some good information. And if I’m gonna go find that mystic pizzeria in Vietoledo, in Naples, how do I know it’s not already played out? And 15,000 reviews can’t be wrong, but when you get there and the line is around the block and you can have just a good experience.

AC (18:50)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (19:03)
you know, 10 feet away. All of that kind of comes into, it’s about information and knowledge and how to use it and kind of the wisdom, the principle here. So anyway, all that to say, planning can seem like so benign or how do I say, just something so typical that everybody should think of, but nobody does because it’s just kind of trying to wing it.

AC (19:12)
Mm-hmm.

Basic.

Brian Alex (19:32)
I really feel like gone are the days of being able to really wing it over here. You’re gonna get sucked into, if you go by the Cedar Pane, you’re just gonna get sucked into whatever tourist trap or blogger who’s getting a kickback and revenue stream and all of this, and you’re gonna get, you’re gonna have a nominal experience and you paid all this money to get here. You took.

you know, a week, two weeks, three weeks off of work, all of that. And it’s just this lost time and lost money. It’s just an investment gone wrong. And I’m so sorry for people that come over and say, I went to Rome, I’ll never go back. I went to Venice and I never go back. I went to Naples, I’d never go back. my God, you did not have a great experience then.

AC (19:59)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, we have.

Mm-hmm, it’s the worst.

No, it’s the worst. mean, what’s funny is you’ll have these customers that are overwhelmed, or just people I’m talking to outside of the customers too, they’re overwhelmed and they’ll have half their trip built. And then they’re like, so what do you think of this? And I’m just there to help them. I’m not there as an agency or a curator or designer. It’s just to help them. Hey, yeah, give me a call. Let’s get together, coffee, talk about it. I’m like, where did you find that restaurant? Yeah, I it on Instagram. Yeah, you can’t go there.

Did you look this up? Yeah, I found that on TripAdvisor there’s 70,000 reviews for a pasta-making class in a restaurant in the middle of Florence which, you know, it’s not gonna be real experience, you know? But that’s what they find, you know? And that’s why if you go to our Instagram, funny, it’s boring. Not boring, but we don’t have, we don’t name restaurants, we don’t name any of our tours, because we don’t want, you we want people to, you know, be old-school type of places that not overwhelmed, you know what I mean? That are, you know, not Instagram blown up.

And we’ve got more stories that Brian and I have been to a restaurant. I myself and my wife been to a restaurant 10 years ago, I meet the owner, I could walk in. Now it’s number three in Florence. And you know, they have two sittings and it’s blown up all over Facebook and Instagram. And you know, these are the problems. But most of the time, that’s what happens is the planning part of it is what can really have a bad experience. And you’re right. Or bad experience or different experience. Yeah.

Brian Alex (21:18)
Yeah.

You never had these

kind of things before. You never had multiple sittings. You show up at a restaurant, that’s your table. You’ve got it for four or five hours until they close the doors. Nowadays, you’ve got the different turns, kind of more American. You’ve also got a lot of places, touristy places, let’s be honest. Amalfi Coast or even Venice, Florence.

AC (21:46)
Mm-hmm.

Lawrence.

Brian Alex (22:08)
where they have a credit card reservation required. Certain bars and experiences are gonna require that. All of that’s really new. And again, that’s why some of this does, if you wanna get into those kinds of places, some of this does require planning. And so for those listening, you might be asking yourself, well, how can I plan? If I’m gonna just go over on my own, how do I plan or what do I need to think about?

What are some of the reasons even to do the planning? And I’d say one of the biggest reasons, and talking about building blocks of itineraries, okay, let’s say you’ve got your cities pinned. We’ve talked about it already just a few minutes ago. You come into Rome, maybe. You’re gonna head up through the heartland, through the center of the peninsula. Maybe you’re gonna do a town like Cortona, which we love.

Florence, maybe a Bologna just for a stop and then you head up to Venice, you’re out of Venice. Okay, so you’ve got your basic route, but then, you know, the building blocks inside of those, as you break it down, inside of each of those stops, you’ve got building blocks and those are, first of all, accommodations. Accommodations end up being kind of the bookends of your stay in a town, because…

AC (23:29)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (23:33)
You go there, maybe you have a meal before check-in is open, but what’s in front of your mind is check-in at the new accommodation. I’ve got to set up a base, so to speak. I’m gonna put my luggage somewhere. I’m gonna get in the door and then I’m gonna be on foot maybe if I don’t have a vehicle or I’m gonna try to figure out my surroundings so that I can kind of feel comfortable and then enjoy for a day or two, however long I’m there.

before heading to the next place. Would you agree with that? Accommodations are kind of fundamental.

AC (24:06)
Yeah, would think for accommodations, but even before that, when you’re looking at a trip like this in the major cities, it’s the neighborhood, then the accommodations. So you might love an accommodation, but it’s the wrong area. So it’s about, fundamentally, of course, it’s accommodations because you’re going to sleep. where are you having, where are you putting those accommodations in that city? And that’s a big, big mistake. And how many customers are people talk to me and they’re like, hey, we’re standing at the Vatican. I’m like, yeah, let’s stay.

let’s say in a quieter neighborhood outside of Vatican, near the Vatican, but a little like where you were when we with you in Rome, even Prati or something like that. that’s another, when you look at accommodations, you have to tide it in, where is the accommodations, particularly in the neighborhoods of Rome and Venice and stuff like

Brian Alex (24:56)
Yeah, that’s a great nuance here. mean, if we’re talking about accommodations, because our kind of our bookends, we’ve already decided on the city we want to be in. But even in that city, we have neighborhoods, zones, areas that can be conducive to what it is that we’re trying to do there or a little counterproductive. know, for instance, a Rome, you might.

be in Rome, going to Rome because you want to see the Vatican or you want to see the Roman Forum or some of the big ticket items that everybody has to see the first time or second or third time, who knows? But with that said, where do you go from there and how do you get there? Do you actually have to be around the corner from the Roman Forum to see it and enjoy it? Maybe you’d hate it.

You know, if you were based in an Airbnb right outside of the Coliseum, that may be a terrible area for you. And so of course you’re gonna want to think about, if I paid a little extra to get me to that one event or that one tour, the two tours that I’m gonna go do, but my living experience in the town is much better.

lower foot traffic, lower crowds, and I just have the ability to go outside and breathe and relax, sit down at a bar and have an appetitivo, that kind of thing. Am I going to enjoy that more than being right there smack looking at the Vatican and it’s just maybe a terrible experience? So yeah, all that kind of factors into what we’re saying here. I mean, the bottom line is that

not booking far enough in advance is gonna make it really difficult to have that pick that you’re after,

AC (26:51)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it’s a perfect example. just did, we talked about this as a team yesterday. We went to Monopoly in Walpulia in September. And we’re like, all right, let’s book, I think we started booking in May. And I couldn’t find a hotel or a hovel in Monopoly or Gallipoli. know, even Bari was difficult. And those aren’t even Rome. And Rome, of course, has more hotels and more lodging. But you know, with Jubilee this year, you got to think about that. know, with Rome, 35 extra million people coming into Rome in 2025.

Yeah, need to, planning is also about time. How much time do you have? Right now, if you’re looking to go in May, you’re almost too late. So yeah, you just can’t plan, you just gotta plan way ahead of time. Years ago, you could go in three to six months and you could find something. Now it’s, you can still find something, but it might not be in a neighborhood or the lodging that you’re used to, your standards, that’s all.

Brian Alex (27:31)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah, so that’s a lot to consider when it comes to, okay, you’ve got the building blocks, know, your itinerary, your basic route that you’re gonna take, your entrance and exit, what cities you’re gonna visit in those cities, what neighborhoods are important for you to be in, to live in for that 24, 48, 72 hours, whatever, and then where you want to go. And I think that brings up the next point that we wanna talk about is,

having authentic experiences. so separating out your living accommodations from the experience that you wanna have, you know, obviously your living environment is gonna be an experience. mean, if there’s, I don’t know how many times we’ve been in like Bologna, we’ve been in a choice zone in Bologna, but my God, those garbage trucks.

AC (28:36)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (28:40)
at 3 a.m and 4 a.m waking us up every morning was a pain in the butt and so you know it was a perfect location yeah right right yeah it was perfect but a pain in the butt and so you know okay you’ve got your living experience you know and then you have

AC (28:46)
yeah, that was a perfect location too, yeah. And that’s what we learned, right? You just said it before, that’s how we learn these things, right? I’m like, it’s a great location. Look, you can see right outside. And why are those kids marching at three o’clock in the morning? know, so why are they so loud? So yeah. Yeah.

Brian Alex (29:10)
the experiences that you, you whether that’s a tour at the Coliseum, whether that’s the cooking class, the wine tasting, the private, you know, food tour, the history, art, whatever tour that you wanna go do, where are those gonna be? And again, one reason that we talk about planning so much, and it’s so fundamental but so overlooked, is that not doing it far enough in advance,

precludes the fact that you’re not gonna find something that’s authentic. What you’re gonna be left with is where the mass tourism funnels you. I’m not saying necessarily you’re gonna be following somebody with a fluorescent umbrella and 60 people in a row, but it may not be choice. It may not be the best experience. Why wouldn’t you plan far enough in advance to find that better experience that’s more authentic?

You know, again, we’ve talked about this time and time again, that our clients that come back from trips, they don’t talk about those big experiences so much as they talk about the intimate interactions with, you know, a local mom and pop restaurant or the tour guide who was so personable or having a shared meal in somebody’s home. All of that factors into

AC (30:23)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (30:37)
the things that stick in your memory and you go home with these stories about, my gosh, yeah, yeah, yeah, we did this, that and the other, all the Instagrammable things. But let me tell you about this night that we were talking to Giuseppe and his wife Sylvia and their restaurant and they wanna come visit us now in the US and we’re best friends. That’s more life-changing.

AC (30:51)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I think what happens when people plan, whether it’s Instagram, whether it’s talking to other people, or whether it’s the site, so you just mentioned the Coliseum. So when people plan their location, they plan it, alright, how far is it to walk to Trevi Fountain? But never stay near Trevi Fountain, right? It’s crowded, it’s loud, it’s touristy. But instead of planning your accommodations around, how long, this, looking at neighborhoods and doing some investigations on some of the neighborhoods.

or it’s a 15 minute walk to get to the Colosseum or it’s a 14 minute walk to get to Campo de’ Fiori, whatever. That’s what you need to look at and say, do I want to be away from the crowds, more authentic? when I want to go, same thing with Venice. Venice is a perfect example. If you’re going to be stuck right in Rialto Bridge area, you’re not going to like Venice. I’ll tell you that right now. It is not a fun place to be, right?

Brian Alex (31:52)
Yeah.

It’s a zoo.

AC (31:55)
You know, so, yeah, it

is not Italy, it’s not Venetian, it’s just a zoo. It’s like Disney. It’s like being an Epcot, you know, on a 25th anniversary. You know, and you just want to be away, and you’re gonna really strategically, don’t look at the hotel, look at the neighborhood, and then look at the hotel or the accommodations, whatever you’re do in that neighborhood, right? Or that whatever, like you said, region, a zone, or whatever. That’s what need to look at, and that’s part of the planning. Plan there first.

Don’t plan, where’s St. Marcos Square? Where’s Doge’s Palace? Where’s Coliseum? Yeah, exactly, don’t do that.

Brian Alex (32:28)
around the experience, you’re saying plan around the

zone. And I wanna just underscore that, that’s an excellent point because I don’t know how many people we’ve heard from after having stayed in the accommodations that we recommended, that they said, know, I walked out from my hotel, talking about Venice, for example, I walked out from my hotel, there were no crowds, there were just moms and dads with their kids, kids playing soccer in the park. I felt like I was in the real Italy.

AC (32:46)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (32:56)
And we’re like, yes, you were, you were, and you were a dead spot in the middle of Venice, but we found you a place where it could feel like you were home. You know, that’s, that’s kind of what we’re shooting for. Or in Rome, because you choose the right neighborhood. And this is where people live and breathe and eat and drink and have their lives and go to school and all of that. It’s more real. It’s more authentic. And so you’re not getting sucked into all the touristy traps and, know, doing all the hubbub.

AC (32:56)
Yep, and that’s Venice, yeah. Mm-hmm, exactly.

Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (33:25)
You can go and have those experiences, but you’re not planning your accommodation around the experience. The accommodation is an experience in itself, and it’s important one, because you’re going to walk in and out of that place many times over that course of however many hours or days you’re there, and only once to go to that other experience. So it makes sense to center that and base out of somewhere. Let’s talk about also

AC (33:31)
Exactly.

Brian Alex (33:54)
Planning well in advance will help to cut the cost. I know a lot of our partners here in Italy, hotels, B &Bs, boutique, whatever, they still, I mean, we’re late November at the time of this recording, they’re still coming up, a lot of them, with their pricing for next year. But by and large, whatever kind of service you’re looking at,

AC (34:00)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (34:23)
know, restaurants being the exception, but the service side of things, whatever you’re trying to reserve in advance, there’s an advantage to doing that first before others, before the crowds. We find that to be the case time and again.

AC (34:42)
Yeah, Italians have figured out supply and demand, right? And demand and supply, once the supply goes down, demand goes up, that means the cost goes up. And years ago, we still get customers, well, I’m gonna book my flights three months before. Yep, guess what? Most flights are sold out, you can’t get two seats together. It’s not the same. They figured out, the airlines have figured it out, just as much the accommodations have figured it out. So it’s planning on your timeline, too, to book ahead of time, like you said, because it’s not like before.

Brian Alex (34:45)
Hehehehe

AC (35:11)
I mean, you go to Rome, you can’t go to Rome three months before and try to find a great room. You you’re not going to find that. It’s you can find one, maybe it’s a French room where it’s, you know, 16 square meters. And you know, you got to get to go outside to change up, you know, but other than that, yeah, you definitely you know, it’s things have changed in Italy, you know, we’ll talk about that. It’s you got to plan plan, plan, plan, and time, time, time you need. And that’s why a lot of times customers are people talk to me again, general, it’s like, yeah, you need to look at fall.

Let’s not look at April. Let’s not look at March. It looks like a May. let’s, let’s plan outside a little bit. So yeah, exactly. You got to plan that.

Brian Alex (35:47)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. And, you know, some of that cost savings is around the seasonal hikes that will happen. There’s impromptu changes, fluctuations, inflation, even the, how do we say that, the strikes that we experience. Some of those are well announced, well in advance. Others are, you know, can even be 24 hours before.

AC (35:54)
Mm-hmm.

Mm. Yes, yeah.

Brian Alex (36:14)
But all of that can cause the cost of things to fluctuate and when we say fluctuate we mean go up those those costs go up and so another reason to think through the planning and to do that well in advance and to do it how we say in Italian con calma, know calmly is is the stress factor, you know some of that booking early provides a sense of

AC (36:34)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (36:44)
Serenity, sense of stability, security, knowing that you’ve already blocked out, you’ve already locked in, you’ve already, you know, you’ve got those things already taken care of, especially, you know, going to the less touristy places where it’s a little bit more choice and a little bit more authentic, you’re going to have, you know, a better experience. All of that can provide a sense of

okay. Now I can relax. And you know, for a lot of people, especially coming over to Italy for your first time, there is a lot of stress. And I still feel stress when I travel around Italy. Italy can be just stressful, honestly, to travel. Even no matter how much you know or are prepared, there can be stress. And so having…

AC (37:36)
No matter how you plan, exactly. It doesn’t matter. All your best plans

go out the window, actually.

Brian Alex (37:43)
Right, what did Mike Tyson

say? Everybody’s got to plan until they get hit in the face, right? And so having a plan is helpful. It will reduce some of that stress. And I don’t know, I booked flights for the states a couple months ago or a month or two ago, and already I’ve had two flight changes.

AC (37:50)
Exactly.

Brian Alex (38:10)
You and this is, it’s just normal. You’re gonna, you’re gonna have things change. You’re have things fluctuate. You’re gonna have a strike. You’re gonna have delays. You’re gonna have things beyond your control. And you gotta, you gotta recognize, okay, it’s in my control to plan early. It’s out of my control when things go awry and they will, they will go awry. So why not do what you can when you can?

AC (38:10)
Yep.

think,

go ahead, Brian, sorry.

Yeah, I think, like you just said, do what you can when you can. Get that off the table. Get the accommodations off the table. Get the tours off the table. Get that off because they’re going to be the minutiae things, what you have to plan for that come up 30 days before the strike. I got a new Google, whatever, news link that the taxi strikes that happen in the week were there. That’s part of the planning almost tactically, right? And not strategically, we say, right? You’re going to, so you be prepared for those when the short window.

The planning way ahead of time for accommodations and logic and flights way ahead of time because you’re going to have to deal with a lot of little things. Confirmations, phone numbers, locations, where to meet up, all the stuff that we deal with, right? That’s the stuff that you want to, you know, narrow down and have to deal with it 30 days, two weeks, or even a week before. All of a sudden you got a phone number and someone calls you and says that we have to cancel for some unknown reason or we don’t have a car and you’re to have to take a taxi. These are the things that can come up. That’s make sure, you know,

I guess you’d say your tick list of things to worry about before you leave for Italy, then having to worry about, hey, got to get my hotel booked. a month before. Those are the things you’re going to expect. It’s not like going to Germany or going to Las Vegas. These things do happen in Italy. You said about the strikes and hotels closing, restaurants closing. You know that works.

Brian Alex (39:45)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah. Well, I don’t know how many times I’ve booked a restaurant online or called in advance and without warning, not like they didn’t advise me beforehand, I show up at that restaurant and there’s a sign on the door, closed for grievances, luto, they’re grieving the loss of someone, they’re in mourning, et cetera. Or impromptu, they went,

on vacation, feria. Siamo in feria. And you’re like, okay, well, I guess I’m not eating there tonight. There’s no one there. Doors are locked. Lights are off. Yeah.

AC (40:31)
Where were we? That happened to us. We confirmed it twice. Where was it? Bavonia? I

forget where it was, me you. We went and we’re like, dude, I just called yesterday. They answered and we show up and there was no sign on the door, which is closed. And no reason, just showed up. We’re all excited to go. They didn’t even put a sign. was just, basically, I to open up that day. So that happens. Go ahead.

Brian Alex (40:46)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah

Yeah, right.

It happens. Last thing that we’ll say on this planning soapbox that we’re on is a lot of people fail to consider and factor in seasonal events, festivals, and just what we call red days over here on the calendar that you have.

AC (41:13)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (41:16)
you know, national holiday, for example, or a local festival in the town that you’re staying in because you didn’t know. And that that’s a planning issue because you didn’t know what was happening in your town. You you find that there’s a lot of inconveniences. You may find that there’s something extra fun to go to go do see and that you didn’t know about. It could be positive. It could be negative. But.

AC (41:39)
Exactly. That’s the good thing about Italy. That’s the great thing about Italy, right?

Yep, they’re gonna have a great time.

Brian Alex (41:46)
It’s box of chocolates, you know, you never know what you’re gonna get. But all that to say, doing a little bit of that, doing a little bit of research, especially on travel days, we found a lot of people get inconvenienced on travel days because they’re not looking at the calendar to understand, that’s a national holiday. That means trains are gonna be packed. That means this is gonna happen. There’s gonna be gridlock. I’m gonna need extra time. You know, not thinking about

AC (41:49)
Just don’t get the coconut one.

Brian Alex (42:16)
their context that they’re coming into can be a huge inconvenience for them.

AC (42:22)
think a perfect example, you know, I a friend goes to, I think it was Bologna, and he’s like, all right, I’m get a taxi. Taxi stands out here. Tomorrow morning, I’m get the taxi to the train station. And he’s younger, so he’s gonna cut the train station time 10 minutes instead of being in there 40 minutes early. So he walks out to that taxi stand that he’s been to two days in a row. Well, guess what? It’s a Saturday and it’s a market. And the whole street is closed off. So there’s no taxi stand.

Brian Alex (42:46)
It’s closed

AC (42:48)
But he didn’t know about the market, you know, because he didn’t investigate, you know, what happens on Saturdays in Bologna or whatever Saturday in Bologna they have the market there. So he had a walk, how many minutes? Like 14, 15 minutes with his luggage to Bologna train station. And he missed the train. So, but these are the things you don’t know. And that’s why the nuances of your trip when you’re going, these are the things that will cause you, as they say, agita. You’re going to have some, you’re going to have some, you know, stomach issues because you’re going to be stressed.

That’s the stuff you plan and down to the minutiae, you know what mean? Not just the hotels and the end of flight. So those are the things you don’t realize that happen here.

Brian Alex (43:26)
Yep. Yep. Well, look, it’s a lot of good info here for us to consider how to plan, how to wrap our heads around coming into Italy. We use this kind of loose block here of coming into Rome, going to Cortona, Bologna, Venice.

Are there any nuances that we can pull out from? I mean, we’ve mentioned a little bit Rome and Venice here. You mentioned Bologna. Is there any other little nuances that we can pull out from this particular itinerary, how planning can be helpful?

AC (44:10)
Yeah, think planning logistics, that’s the big thing too, from city to city, knowing what works best. mean, Brian and I would probably just do trains. Rome, the Florence is easy. Rome, the Cortona is easy. Rome, the Bologna is easy. Whatever, it’s all easy. But there are times that, you know, when do you need a car service? When do I even want a taxi? How far? Figuring out the distances and what works best. You know, sometimes just walking, you know, and you have to realize that. You know, let’s say you’re in Rome.

and you want to have dinner at this fancy restaurant and it’s above the Spanish Steps. Well that’s a, if you’re staying in Trastevere or in Nevada, you got a 40 minute walk. You know, remember those things when you figure out how do my logistics look day to day, not just planning your trip. So when you plan your trip in a big city, realize why am I booking a restaurant that’s 40, 35 minute walk away? How is it going to look when I get out of the restaurant to find a taxi? Where’s the taxi stand? And get back to my hotel that night. Do I want to work 40 minutes, 35 minutes from it?

These are the things you need to look at at these major stops, right? So logistics is something else that could be a real hamper. If it’s 100 degrees out, it’s the middle of July. Do you want to walk 35 minutes, right? To have a happy hour, right? These are the things logistically you also need to look at. NCC goes up too, as you get closer, right? The NCC is the car services. So you need to look at all of those connecting tissues, my wife likes to call them, connectivity to everything in your trip.

Brian Alex (45:17)
Mm-hmm.

AC (45:35)
not just your day to day, how are you getting from city to city. that has to be planned well in advance too.

Brian Alex (45:40)
Yeah.

Yeah. And I think the nuance there in particular for a place like Cortona, yeah, there’s a train station nearby, but not in Cortona. And so if you’re trying to get to Cortona, you’re stopping at Camucha Cortona, which is all the way at the bottom of the hill. You would not want to walk that. And so you’d have a little bit of a taxi or local car service, which can be an obstacle.

AC (45:49)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Brian Alex (46:09)
And so if you don’t do the research, you wouldn’t know that and you’re going to get there and you you get to the closest that you can, Camucha Cortona, and then you’re stuck because you didn’t think about that little piece in advance. There was a lack of planning.

AC (46:26)
Yeah, funny story of Cortona, a little anecdotal story. I was just there in October and the hotel that we work with a lot there, Monestero, great hotel, and I said, can you get me a taxi? Because I wasn’t staying at the hotel, I was staying at an Airbnb. He’s like, yeah, yeah, I know them well, as you know. And you get the taxi, I get the car and it says taxi. He picks me up, I forget his name. And I go down, I look at the car, I go down to the train station, Kabucha train station, there’s the taxi stand and it’s his phone number.

on the taxi stand. He’s the only taxi in Cortona. Not kidding. He’s the only taxi. It’s like one of those towns you just can’t he goes, I am the taxi. I’m like, get out of here. I get it. I’m looking at him as the taxi stand. I am the tax. I’m the only and I’m like, why is it like he is the typical Italians I own. Basically no one else can get a license in this town but me. Right. And so those are the things you don’t realize. Exactly. But these are the things you don’t realize when you go to these towns. Like, how am going to get from the bottom of this hill to that hilltop town?

Brian Alex (47:06)
I am the taxi.

His cousin’s with the mayor.

AC (47:25)
you know, that’s 15 minutes above me. Well, guess what? You’re have to use a car service, so you’re gonna wait for that guy who hopefully is not driving people to Rome as a taxi, you know? So there really is certain towns that logistically can be really difficult, so it’s funny. I’m like, that’s interesting. So, all right, go ahead.

Brian Alex (47:34)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I hope that this has been helpful to folks that are planning their next trip coming over. Planning is essential. Gone are the days of coming over and doing a three month backpacking or motorcycle tour in Italy. I mean, you can do it. You need to plan, though. You really do need to plan. Honestly, it would be in your best interest. But all that said, there are some.

AC (48:02)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (48:09)
really great positives, some advantages, especially now with tourism booming, especially with so much online, so much access to information, you would think that, you know, it would be kind of intuitive that, okay, with so much information, I can plan less because I’ll have all that available. You know, it means that everybody has that available. It’s counterintuitive, but you do need to plan even more.

in advance so that when you get to Italy you can relax a little bit and that I think is the whole point for at least most people coming over is to have a great experience to relax and enjoy while they’re here.

AC (48:35)
Mm-hmm.

I think the other thing is, you hit the nail on the head there is information. There’s so much that you can’t delve through who is the expert. Am I paying attention to this person because he’s got a million likes but she just came from France and now she’s in Rome and she’s telling me what sandwich to get or what hotel to stay at. This is what I mean about information overload and it doesn’t help. It doesn’t help your planning because you’re hearing too many voices, whether it’s your family who just came back, whether it’s Brian and Anthony talking to you.

or whether it’s Instagram or Facebook. And that’s why I think the travel agency or we design trips here, that’s why our business is growing and a lot of these businesses grow because we’re succinct and we’re not listening to a lot of data points, right? We are the data point and that’s gonna happen. That can be overwhelming and like you said at the beginning, but that comes down to planning and getting away from the noise. Where is the noise? What do I have to take out of this equation? Is it my family?

Is it Brian and Anthony? Is it Instagram, right? So you need to figure out what is important to you. Do you wanna go swimming? Do you wanna see art? Do you wanna see history? That’s part of the planning too. Stop getting the noise out of there. What you really wanna do. Make a list of what you really wanna do when you go to that city and then whittle it down. Who do you want to be the tour guide? Who do you want to build the trip for you? That kind of stuff. That’s the kind of stuff you wanna address when you plan to. I went on my soapbox, sorry.

Brian Alex (50:14)
Yeah, I love it. no, that’s

perfect. And look, we have been accused before of, you know, touting too much Italy with Bella. But hey, look, this is this is our our life experience is what we do for a living with this company, Italy with Bella. So how can we not draw from that to share free information with people that are coming over and hopefully some of this?

AC (50:30)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (50:42)
has been helpful, you know, just value, hopefully, for people that are planning their next trips. If you are overwhelmed, if you feel like, I wanna leave it to the experts, if you want less stress and fuss and just more to enjoy, then consider coming to Italy with Bella. Head over to italywithbella.com. Plan your free consultation call with Anthony and his wife, Denise.

No strings attached. You don’t get charged for anything. It’s just a free call. If you like what you hear, you want to come over, I don’t think you’re going to regret it. Over 140 five-star reviews on Google would say you’re not going to regret it. If you’ve enjoyed this podcast, folks, first of all, thank you for tuning in. Would you head over to whatever platform you’re listening on and give us a five-star review? It would be much appreciated.

and it would help others like yourselves planning for Italy to come over and travel well when they get here. So all that to say, thank you so much. We will see you next time with another set of principles to apply when coming over on your next trip to Italy. In the meantime, enjoy and arrivederci.

AC (52:05)
thank you everyone.