Traveling Well: Lessons from the Road

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Episode summary

In this episode, Brian and Anthony reconnect after a six-month hiatus, diving into their recent travels in Italy.

They explore the theme of ‘traveling well’ and share highlights from their adventures, including visits to less-traveled regions and cultural insights from coastal experiences.

The conversation touches on the challenges of accessing hidden gems in Italy, the allure of Abruzzo, and the discovery of new destinations like lakes. The hosts emphasize the importance of understanding local culture and the unique experiences that come from venturing off the beaten path.

In this episode, Brian and Anthony also discuss the importance of balancing relaxation and exploration while traveling in Italy. They explore various destinations, including Lake Garda and the Dolomites, highlighting their unique experiences and attractions. The conversation also touches on lesser-known towns like Matera and Volterra, emphasizing the value of authentic experiences away from tourist hotspots.

They conclude by discussing the unpredictability of travel seasons and the need for careful planning to ensure enjoyable trips.

Episode Transcript

Brian Alex (00:01)
Hey guys, we are back around again. Anthony and Brian, Brian and Anthony coming at you. Hey, it has been a hot minute. You took six months to get back in front of the mic and listeners would like to know where have you been? Our entire fan base, all three have been taking to social media and petitioning the Bella Italy podcast back around. So what have you to say to them, Anthony? You’re on the spot.

Ac (00:32)
So the last six months, been back and forth to Italy, been with you, been with some of our team, been with some of the members here of our team too, and the Italy team. Definitely saw some new sites, some new partners, but yes, do miss doing this with you. And hopefully our three, maybe four now, Brian, with the new season coming up, will enjoy this new season of season four with the Bella Podcast.

Brian Alex (00:56)
Well, I hope so. folks, if you are just tuning in, you haven’t missed much. We’ve just chatted about Italy this and that over the last season. We’re kicking off here season four. being that, as Anthony said, as we’re turning our mics on today, I feel a little rusty. Yeah, me too.

Ac (01:22)
Yeah, real rusty.

Brian Alex (01:23)
So let’s warm up a little bit. Yeah, it has been six months or so. I think it was in the summer when we were churning out these these particular episodes. We did a finale, kind of a little mini series on the idea of traveling well. That’s a that’s a theme we want to pick up in this new season as we dive into season four here. We’re late fall, midwinter. I don’t know where are we in?

in real time in 2024, but we’re pushing into 2025 and kicking off this season four. I thought it’d be good to pick up this theme and let’s use it as an example. Some of the trips that you’ve been on, you’ve been on several trips over here to Italy. I’ve had the pleasure, I’ll just say it like that, of traveling with you.

Ac (02:14)
Why thank you, thank you. I don’t get that often. I usually get I traveled

with Anthony, I don’t have the pleasure in front of it.

Brian Alex (02:22)
Hi,

I got my t-shirt that I survived Another couple trips over here with Anthony and so we’re tell us where have you been? What have you done? What were some of the the highlights of your adventures over here in the Bell Paese?

Ac (02:28)
Yes.

Yeah, so some of the highlights. I actually was over there in June, but that was more of a shorter trip. Went to Rome in Tuscany. And then I, why am I drawing a blank? I was up in Lake Garda in the Dolomites in May. And then I was in Puglia, why am I drawing a blank? September. And then I went up to see you in Abruzzo, Rome, where we took our SOM test. We’ll talk about that another time. And then we went.

Brian Alex (03:06)
I’m wearing my pen. I don’t know. I don’t want

to rub it in or anything, but I’m wearing my pen here just in case anybody can’t see it. Yeah.

Ac (03:11)
my gosh.

So Anthony didn’t get his pin, but that’s another podcast. Remember girls and boys. Remember girls and boys. When you go to take a test, make sure you study. Cause Anthony showed up very cocky. Like he was back in high school and showed up like he was taking an accounting class.

Brian Alex (03:21)
You got the rowdiest student award. Sitting

all back in the bus like you were. Rowdiest student. but that’s another podcast for another day.

Ac (03:41)
smoking cigarettes yeah i basically yes it is i do not have

a pin and i will have to address that on my own because i never learn so brian was very studious he had a nice folder and he came out with a pin and i didn’t that’s all you need to know then we went to a marquee and we went to bruto after that but

Brian Alex (03:52)
I got a pin.

Ac (04:08)
Yeah, some good insight into the regions that we’ve not been to or in depth been to in those two regions. So we had a fun time and it was enlightening to say the least.

Brian Alex (04:18)
Yeah, mean, I don’t want to throw Italy under the bus. Well, maybe I do. I don’t know. I do want to chime in on that little note to say there are some reasons that some regions are less frequented, less traveled. The road less traveled is sometimes the road you should not travel on. I’ll just say it like that to throw another poem under the bus there.

Ac (04:36)
Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Brian Alex (04:47)
No, it Lamarca was was interesting. We learned a lot one of the funny takeaways from from being along the coastline there And the the brown churning waters of their seaside Do you want to share what we heard from our favorite wine? owner vineyard partner there

Ac (04:55)
Hmm.

I think it would be a quote. Yes.

A partner, yeah. So Brian and

I, Brian and I are kind of in the end of the season in September. And basically we stayed at the beach in, what was it? forget what town we were in. I’m just kind of, yeah, growing up. Pesaro, so we’re in, yeah, down to San Benedetto. So we were in Pesaro and I’m at the beach, he’s at the beach. We’re like, you know, I’m at one hotel and he’s a short walk, five minute walk over. I’m in the Lungomare, which was really nice, walking along the, it was beautiful weather too.

Brian Alex (05:26)
Well, we had done Pesaro and then come down, yeah.

Ac (05:41)
It just had a lot of rain and I’m looking the only people out there on the beach was Germans and it was like 65 degrees in their bikinis and the speedos and the Italians are not there. I’m like, what is going on? It was really, it was, it was actually sunny and nice. And for two days, Brian and I just scratching our heads, walking up and down this, this boardwalk. We’re like, let’s go see this partner. We go visit these family owned winery. Great story behind them would be a great partner, great experience and just ideas that we’ve not seen.

Brian Alex (06:05)
Incredible experience, yeah.

Ac (06:10)
in our travels in Italy for vineyards. So Brian goes, so what’s going on with the, tell them where we’re staying and what’s going on with the beaches. he was like, we don’t go to the beach. We’re mountain people. I’m like, but you’re like, you’re literally 10 minutes from the beach and he doesn’t go to the beach. I was like, surprise. We’re mountain people. I never heard that. Was that exact line? Did he say that?

Brian Alex (06:22)
Hey.

Yeah, yeah, and

it was interesting because their proximity to the coastline, but it’s not something that they go and enjoy. mean, you know, I’m in Sicily and, you know, I’m 45 minutes an hour from the nearest decent beach. That’s not, you know, well, I won’t go and all that. I got to be careful how much I throw Italy under the bus on this first episode open and I don’t want to turn anybody off, but.

It’s at least 45 minutes an hour. We’re itching to go. I mean we look for any excuse that we can. Could we make that work? Could we go there and back in a day? You know this kind of thing. And they’re 10 minutes from the beach and they don’t and we’re like okay well why not? And then he went down a list of reasons that we had seen. Well the water is ugly and choppy and just you know difficult. It’s not peaceful. It’s not a

Ac (07:21)
Those were his words too, yeah.

Brian Alex (07:25)
It’s not an escape. Where do you go to escape? You go up into the mountains from there. They go inland. They hit some of their natural parks, national parks. They do excursions inward and not towards the coastline. And so along the coastline, what do you find? You find all of these German campers that they’ve migrated. It’s like, you know, it brought back to mind.

Ac (07:29)
Mmm.

Yeah

Brian Alex (07:52)
kind of Gulf Coast, maybe Upper Panhandle, Florida, where you’ve got some parts that are pretty and you got like the Alabama or you’ve got the other side of Galveston, you got the Texas side of the Gulf. Galveston then, Corpus Christi, yeah, all of this.

Ac (08:06)
Let’s say Galveston. We have a lot of customers from Alabama and Tennessee. And Florida. Galveston. Brownwater. Yes. Thank you.

Brian Alex (08:16)
I mean it has other reasons that you would go there I guess maybe you want to get over the border really quick because I don’t think they have the wall there yet anyway point is not to get off topic but it felt a little bit like Florida coastline in some uglier parts I guess the water was really rough and choppy and we’ve got all these trailers out there and it was like you’ve got snowbirds and so instead of them coming down from you know north the northeast

Ac (08:25)
I digress.

That’s what I felt like.

Brian Alex (08:46)
New England area down to Florida. You’ve got the Germans and Austrians coming down to the the uglier Stepsister side of Italy’s Adriatic. Yeah

Ac (08:58)
What was interesting for a real experience, it was very local. Because when we walked away from the beach, even five minutes into town, we were even noticing the houses. It felt like a New England town in certain ways, the streets, it was clean. It was very… Like if you said I was in Italy, I’d be surprised. I was walking through the streets. It was very strange to me. And I’m like, this is a different experience because it was so local. No, but you know what I mean. I was really…

Brian Alex (09:16)
Yeah, yeah. This is so clean it can’t be Italy!

Ac (09:28)
And with the people were friendly, we had great meals. That’s gonna take a lot of work to build up from a tourism type of perspective, just whether getting in and out or what to do, you know?

Brian Alex (09:40)
Yeah, no, and back to our point, there are reasons for some of these regions being less frequented, the road less traveled, as we said at the beginning. And some of that is that the roads themselves, the infrastructure hasn’t been built up. I remember, this is Trump’s first presidency.

He came over here to Tarmina for one of these, you know, big, big level meetings and it flew into Tarmina. So what did they do? Catania as a city, of course, was the landing pad, you know, and then, you know, he’s going up the coast. so they come in and they’re literally rebuilding the roads so that the caravan can actually get from Catania to Tarmina. Tarmina is one of the big name.

you know, attractions here in Sicily. And so even if you have a more frequented route like Catania, Tarmini, there’s still reason that, you know, if you have a high level dignitary coming through, they’re going to go in and try to, you know, fill in the potholes all of a sudden in preparation for that. you know, even if this is the point, even if it is, you know, I don’t know, what was the the show White Lotus or whatever?

Ac (10:35)
Mm, it’s Sicily, yeah.

Hmm.

Brian Alex (11:01)
that has a point of attraction and becomes well known, it’s still Italy. And so you’re still dealing. And so how much more if it’s unknown, I mean, how many Americans go to Pesaro, go to Ancona, go to Pescara, down that whole Foggia, it’s the uglier Adriatic side.

Ac (11:08)
Mm.

Hmm. Hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (11:29)
Not that all of the Adriatic is like that, but you have that uglier side that’s just less frequented. It was hard to get to, honestly. We looked at train routes and, you know, there’s certain times of the year that trains will go. I was thinking about Tropea. Tropea is on this other side, you know, facing towards the west here. And it’s very popular, very clean, easier.

Ac (11:47)
Mm.

Brian Alex (11:55)
to get to but still the trains only go there on certain you gotta look at the train schedules coming from Sicily to get up there because certain days it’ll go by on a regional other days you gotta go all the way up to La Mezia and then come back down it’s really crazy so even you know just being well known is not enough I guess is my point but we found it a little difficult to get to but once you got there super clean nice and in order

Nobody’s honking and yelling and it’s not the typical Italian atmosphere. It was really different and probably marked by their tourism industry, which was prevent, know, prevalently, Tedeschi, Francese, right? I mean, was interesting how that left a mark on it.

Ac (12:38)
lacking mm-hmm yeah yeah

So I could see where Americans would like it because they’re not seeing other Americans. I could see where they would like it because they can go to a villa and relax and be in the country, do hiking, be at some national parks. know, there’s still great food, you know, and a lot of nature. So I see that. But it’s more about once you get there, plant yourself there. And then, you know, I guess I’d to talk about San Benedetto. I thought that was a find and one of my colleagues was there. So.

Brian Alex (13:09)
Yeah. A cute little,

yeah, treasure trove of natural beauty, cleanliness, and, and, you know, lower crowd levels, I’d say.

Ac (13:15)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it was really nice. It reminded me a little bit of a 30A, the water didn’t of course, but I thought the it was still at the brownish brackish water for the Adriatic down there. But it was really done well for tourists or least local, you know, Italians that wanted to go to the beach. What do they call it? The Palm, Palm Tree City or something like that. It had a great lungomare, a lot of scooters and activity with families. So really nice beach town. I thought if you’re going to go to the beach, once again, how do you get in and out from there?

you know, as a destination, I think that was the problem we had there.

Brian Alex (13:56)
Right. Yeah, a lot of these places, whether you’re on that Adriatic side going to a town like San Benedetto or on the other side, Tropea, because that’s a well-known destination, it really has to be a destination. It’s hard to work that into an itinerary. A lot of our itineraries, especially in the north, they’ll work in this way that you maybe fly into or out of a major

metropolitan city like a Venice or Rome. And then you you know, so you bookend with those and then in the middle, maybe you hit, you know, some of our favorites of Florence, a Cortona, Bologna, you go up to the lake areas, either Garda or Como, you do some of the more well known attractions, let’s say, but the the the ingress egress how

Easy it is to either find public transportation or use the auto strada It’s really simple and it’s easy and it’s fast and it’s efficient But when we’re talking about some of these other places, it’s hard to just tack on a San Benedetto If you’re not even in that area, you’ve got to really be coming down from you got to be doing that whole you know backside of the thigh of the the Italian Peninsula you got to be coming down from Venice and

Ac (15:06)
Exactly.

Brian Alex (15:19)
all the way like towards Bari and Puglia to make it even worthwhile. Otherwise, what would you be doing? How would you find yourself on that side of the peninsula, right?

Ac (15:32)
Yeah, I think it’s more for customers. And this is why we do what we do, Brian, right? If we didn’t do this, then how do we offer? What do we offer? Why do they go? What customers fit for it, right? So we look at it from that perspective and we liked it. It was just eye opening in a lot of ways for us, right? But yeah, like coming down from Bologna to Ravenna and then Ravenna on the coast coming down or up into Marquet, right? So I think that’s the way you would do it. But yeah, I mean, it’s one of those customer doesn’t want to see Americans. Has been to Italy many times, thinks they’ve seen everything. And this is where you basically would

Brian Alex (15:45)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Ac (16:02)
you know, hey, let’s try something. Exactly. Yes. So I think, I think that’s what

Brian Alex (16:03)
You haven’t seen this! I guarantee ya! Yeah.

Ac (16:09)
we get out of it. Abruzzo though, on the other side, I think is definitely a lot of potential there. I think you felt that, Pescara was, we were on a Sunday. We thought it was a living, walking, the walking dead episode, cause we were the only people. Yes.

Brian Alex (16:20)
Yeah. Well, and it had rained a lot, to be fair, know, Italian,

especially here in Sicily, any drop of rain and they scatter like, I don’t know, I won’t make an analogy, but like some creature going away and finding refuge, you know, even if it’s just a tut tut looks like rain, they just disappear.

Ac (16:33)
Yep.

Ants, ants. Yeah.

Yeah

Brian Alex (16:49)
And so we found ourselves in some ghost towns when and then I think the next day the sun came out and all of a sudden they come out like the living dead, you know, they’re like, what is that huge ball of fire in the sky? I’m blinded, you know, and they start, you know, coming back out and you see it. And, know, of course, for Germans and Austrians and the French coming down, it’s like they’re it’s high summer, you know, for them. But yeah. OK. Well.

Ac (17:11)
It’s nothing. Yeah, exactly. Well, it was a Sunday.

So when we were there, it was actually not bad when we got there. was actually what we sat outside. The weather was so nice, but it was no one. Then we realized, hey, it’s Sunday. It’s quiet. It was only one restaurant we had picked. It was really good. But after dinner, it was after dinner time, everyone was out there. was music playing, people walking down to the beach. It was really active. was really a place if you wanted to get an understanding of Italian culture, what’s going on. It still had that old.

Italian culture feel after Sunday after meal after dinner on Sunday everyone was out and about it was no Americans. If you remember that, but I really enjoyed that town, even though it was a short period of being there. But I think I think a Brutso is as we discussed is somewhere that we can dig into a little more, because you can get to Bari, you can get to Rome, and there’s a train from Rome to Piscata.

Brian Alex (18:05)
Yeah, we actually took a car service over when we were going from Rome. That was after our wine sommelier test. don’t know if you remember. Anyway, as we came over in triumphant victory after having done the class there in Rome. Anyway, we took car service and it was really pleasant. mean, that was not difficult at all.

Ac (18:17)
killin’

Brian Alex (18:29)
gubio and all this, you know, the, the truffle country of the interior there was really fun. we’ve put on our calendar, some other places, La Aquila and, and, some higher towns, more remote locations coming up in the next season. But all that to say, mean, yeah, you’re right. As you were saying a minute ago, this is one of the reasons that we do what we do an earlier trip, just to backpedal for a second, was in the,

the other coastline from Rome going north up to like Livorno and this whole stretch of area. There’s a couple of reasons. Won’t get into it now on this particular episode, but there’s a couple of reasons that we were investigating some places there. you know, those are, it’s that destination kind of mentality that you got to get to. One of the things we discovered, at least you probably knew, I didn’t, I’d never been to Bracciano as a lake.

Ac (19:27)
Mm.

Brian Alex (19:28)
before we’ve talked about lakes. It’s, you know, coming from Tennessee, the brown, murky water just kind of wigs me out a little bit. And having been to Chattanooga, the aquarium, and seen what’s at the bottom of Nickajack Lake, you know, I have good reason to be afraid of those lakes in Tennessee. But anyway, I digress. Finding, you know, well, bravo.

Ac (19:50)
I’ve been here 14 years, I’ve never been to a lake in Tennessee. If I can’t see my feet, I don’t go in.

Brian Alex (19:55)
Good good for you smart smart

But the point was going to this was you know, we discovered I was with one of our colleagues Leonardo and as we were as we were Experiencing this, know, just it made sense. It’s 45 minutes north of Rome We’re kind of giving away a free free piece of candy here But you know for for folks that are either coming in

and getting off of a long travel itinerary to get over here to Italy, because it can be exhausting. It can be full of stress. You have delays. Some people, you just feel that stress with traveling, especially with a family and others. And you finally get over on Italian soil. And rather than packing their day with

going and putting down the luggage and then starting their first tour and you know just getting into the rat race you know into the muck of it you know taking a little bit of a break it for some people might be a really great idea and escaping 45 minutes up the coast not even getting into downtown rome that area but you know from fiume machine or you just go you head right up north and you’re in bracciano and you’re having you know really four five-star experience resort area

overlooking the lake, there’s peace, there’s low crowds, great food, little hilltop towns to visit. It’s the perfect little respite from all that travel that you just did so that you can either turn around and go back down to Rome and enjoy Rome. And this is something we’ve talked about. This kind of goes into our theme that we’re talking about why we do what we do, how to travel well. Being well rested enables you to actually absorb and

enjoy an experience, you know, you get off the plane, you’re stressed, all of this, and you go right into a tour and you can’t even take it in because you’re sleep deprived, you know, dehydrated, you’re stressed and all of that. And, you know, your eyes are red and your ears are buzzing. And, you know, how do you really enjoy something? And so, you know, just learning where do I need to take a break? Where do I put that pause? And I can actually just

Relax a little I know for me and and I’m in my 50s now I need those moments where I plan a little bit of relax and and Respite I don’t know. Are you the same way or you just can’t wait to get out on the street?

Ac (22:19)
Ahem.

See, I might be the opposite. I’m the opposite.

I’m geared up and I want to get to Rome. And this is a good, this is good. This is looking at both sides of the coin here. When I’m get off that plane, I’m ready to go. I want to be in that city. I want to see it. Then after two days, I’m like, all right, my jet lag’s over. I’ve got my energy. Now I need to calm down. So I look at Brasciano, Galletta, you know, on the, you know, being on the water either way. What I look at it as maybe there’s some customers that want to be based in Rome.

Brian Alex (22:36)
Mm-hmm.

Ac (22:55)
They get those couple of days, they get to their hotel, they relax, they do a couple of things, they see the sights, then they’re ready to move on out of Rome or they’re using Rome as a base and they’re going to Tivoli, Brasciano and Gaeta and they never leave Rome for the whole trip and they go to Naples and use Rome as a base. That’s a good segue in maybe the next episode of this about Jubilee and that being a base. So that’s good point to make for the upcoming season. Go ahead.

Brian Alex (23:16)
Right, right, right,

Yeah, good, yeah, thanks for mentioning that. We will get into, for those that don’t know, 2025, especially for our listeners of a Catholic background that are participating in that. Whether you’re coming over to Italy or not to participate in Jubilee next year, there is an impact and we’ll get into that on a future episode. But all that to say, no, it’s a good…

perspective to kind of pivot between the two and understand how you are as a traveler and how you accumulate and then release stress while you’re vacationing so that you can enjoy. If you’re not coming over and enjoying, yeah, it’s wasted money, wasted time. so, and that kind of, you know, that’s exactly what we want to talk about on this fourth season. In every episode,

How do we reinforce this idea of how people can travel well when coming over to Italy? you also went up, I don’t wanna leave this out, you went up to Garda and had some experience there. I love Garda. It is this other kind of off the beaten path. If you’re on the western side going up like Salò to Limone and then up to the north.

It’s even more difficult. It’s connected to Brescia, but there’s no train system. You got to be on buses or private car, that kind of thing on the side towards Verona, where you guys were a little bit better connected because there’s more towns, but still not your normal, you know, high traffic area. But you had some great experiences. We guys met with some partners, wine tasting, some excursions.

Ac (25:09)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (25:10)
Tell us a little bit about what that experience was like.

Ac (25:13)
Yeah, Gardner was great. And you’re right. But the good thing about Gardner on the Veneto side is being near Verona, right, as a base or being in Badalino getting to Verona. It’s very easy to get around, whether it’s to train from Verona and Pesqueda del Garda or up to Badalino or up to Garda, the actual town of Garda. That whole strip is really easy to get around, whether it’s by train or car, but it’s a short train ride. And you’re right about the Brescia side. It’s a little different. Once again, we were there in April, May, and it was

a lot of Austrians and Germans. mean, was the menus, some of the food. So you’ll notice a little bit of a more Germanic type of… Exactly. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, was definitely the lodging is different. It’s more of an RV. You’re not going to get a lot of five star.

Brian Alex (25:52)
You’re waiting for a rivadecci in there like, vida zane!

Ac (26:08)
type of lodging there, but it was really, when you get into nature and e-bikes and walking out on the lake, that’s what was nice about Garda. it was, it was definitely not like the pristine feel of, of a Como, you know what I mean? Like the fabulous, what are they called? Rich and fabulous, rich and famous, you know, it was more of like local, you know. Exactly.

Brian Alex (26:28)
Yeah, the nature part was clean, but

it wasn’t like this elevated experience you’re saying like people are used to if they’ve been to the Lake Como, example, or Lugano. You’ve got this sense of a little bit high society and you pay a little bit more. Maybe the quality of food isn’t like it is here in the South, know, etc. But OK, it’s a different experience. Yeah, Garda.

On the other hand, I had the same experience a lot more. Yeah, these kind of mid area Europeans coming down and enjoying the sunshine, getting into a lake area. So you see that they cater. They cater to that in the menu, they cater to that in the tourism industry is built around that. And so what we’re asking ourselves, whether in the Garda area going all the way up to Bolzano and towards the border,

towns or whether you’re in a market or, you know, on this other side, the Adriatic. One, what’s to do and see there? What’s the attraction? What would bring somebody in? And then how do you get them there? And, you know, it’s not that we need to go in and invent new reasons to go visit these areas. We don’t get any, you know, kickback from that. But what I’m asking myself is, is there a reason

that somebody would want to go. I know for a lot of Italians going up to like a Bolzano, it’s one of the few places in Italy that has a very long and well established Christmas market type thing, you know, and that’s hard to find here in Italy. So a lot of people, you you can find it in Florence, okay, there’s some reason for that, Assisi, all this kind of thing, but it’s harder to find. Naples has its own thing that it does. Sicilians really don’t care.

Ac (28:21)
A Sermione.

Brian Alex (28:24)
But yeah, have to go up to some of these higher towns in order to find certain things that you might not see in the rest of Italy. So there’s some reason like that, but I don’t know. What did you guys find as a, hey, this is a well-oiled machine and a big attraction. We need to add this to some itineraries.

Ac (28:45)
Well, firstly, you said the Dolomites, right? So the Dolomites are just spectacular. mean, it’s just whether you’re in the mountains, there’s a lot of history with the wars up there too. So the reason people think of history in other parts of Italy, but there’s a ton of history up in the mountains there, especially when you look at the autonomous of Bolzano, right? Of, you know, between Austria and Italy. So it’s fascinating culturally too to go up there, whether it’s the food culture or the language culture.

or the history, right? But it’s also the beauty, the lakes up in the mountains in Dolomites, there’s no other lakes, I think, in all of Italy that compare to the lakes in the Dolomites, right? The small little lakes, not like Como lakes, but the small, you know, mountain lakes, you know. Exactly.

Brian Alex (29:24)
And you can see your feet when you step in the, if you, if you’re brave enough to step in that frigid, frigid water, you can actually see your feet

as they freeze. Yeah.

Ac (29:34)
It was it’s

it’s it’s definitely something different. It’s like I always say it’s equivalent to like going to Matera is like going to the Dolomites or the Alps, right? I think it’s something so different when you’re in Italy and you’re seeing Piedmont and Tuscany where you have those beautiful, you know, hilltop towns. But I think the Dolomites are definitely something to go see because it has to be also the beauty and also the culture. But coming down into Lake Garda itself is, you know, you can get on the lake with the boat.

You can go over to Salo. Salo is a beautiful little town on the Berescia side and it doesn’t take long on the boat. Of course, like Como, there’s a lot of beautiful, there’s castles, there’s big houses and mansions on the water that you can see by boat. You can jump in the water and guard. I wouldn’t do it in April, but maybe in June and July. But, know, once again, very, a lot like Como and we have a lot of customers that love being on the lake. You’ll have…

You know, especially ironically, Brian, they’re Lake people in Tennessee and in the South, right. And, in Cali and in Reno, get custom, but we get customers all over the country, right. And they’re like, we love the Lake. So, we like to put them on Garda because they’re used to that kind of feel walking, high kayaking, biking. You’re going to get more of that and easier for a family than you will on Como. think it’s a lot flatter coming down to Montevideo with that, that nice bike.

Brian Alex (30:34)
And there’s nothing wrong with that.

Ac (30:59)
The goes from Peschiero del Gatto down to Montevra, which is one of your favorite towns in Italy. So there’s a lot of outdoor natural stuff, but it’s really easy. The other thing I love about it, and we talked about it, it’s so easy to get from the lake to Verona or Peschiero del Gatto down to Bologna. It’s a train that goes right from Peschiero del Gatto down to Bologna. And of course, from Bologna to Florence. Or I think it’s just logistically it’s great.

For outdoor activities, people want to be by the lake. I think it’s a no brainer flying into Venice, going to Verona and being on the lake. But overall, think if you’re expecting the same kind of Como type of experience, it’s not. So if you’ve been to Como, please check out Lake Garda.

Brian Alex (31:41)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I agree. Salo is a little bit like a miniature Lugano. It has that kind of a feel, look and feel to it. So if that’s something you’re you’re into, you’re interested in, definitely worth checking out smaller miniature experience, kind of like Bergamo being a smaller miniature Milanese experience. There’s some reasons to put that on your map. But you mentioned also Matera. Matera is this other kind of anomaly like

Ac (31:47)
Mm-hmm.

Me long, yeah?

Brian Alex (32:10)
It’s disconnected, I guess. There’s not a great train system. There’s not a great way to get in and out. You’ve got to either do private car service or find other means. But all that said, there’s reasons that that would be a destination. I think this kind of goes into our bigger topic, at least for this episode. We’re kind of all over the map here, just doing a little bit of

Ac (32:38)
It’s a big dump.

Yeah. Just dump it all out.

Brian Alex (32:40)
a summary of

what’s happened over the last couple of months to bring people up to speed. But as we get in and we’ll be more specific and defined about the itinerary they’re talking about or the area that we’re talking about. But yeah, in general here, this is one of those areas like the Matera where you don’t just pass by on your way from here to there. You really have to make it on purpose.

Ac (33:03)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (33:08)
part of your itinerary, part of your travel. And so then we’re asking ourselves, okay, is it worth it? How do you get in and out? What do you see and do there? What do people take away from that experience? Would they go back and, know, materas, absolutely a yes to all of those, as is what we’re saying about Lago de Garda. So all of that, did we miss anything, places where we’ve been, things that we’ve done?

Ac (33:26)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (33:37)
over the last couple of months going, I don’t know.

Ac (33:40)
Did I mention

Volterra? I did go to Volterra too in that. I thought it was interesting and it was one of those towns in Tuscany that doesn’t get a lot of recognition. When I think of a Truscan town, like Cortona, Arezzo. But the problem is it’s not on that same path. Ironically, when we travel, it like you and I go to places that people don’t, right? And Volterra, spelt like Cortona.

Brian Alex (33:44)
No, you didn’t mention that, let’s say it.

Ac (34:09)
But there was no Americans. When you go to Cortona now, it’s overloaded with Americans, right? Volterra is a 20 minute ride from the train station, 10 miles. So there’s no trains, right? You’re gonna take it from Florence and you’re gonna have someone pick you up and drive 23. There’s very few hotels in the town. But the town activity wise and beauty and the scenery and where it’s located is spectacular. Cause it’s right down the road from Bogori, about 30 minutes I’m thinking, from Bogori, which is wine country on that side.

Brian Alex (34:11)
Okay. Yeah.

Ac (34:36)
And I really found it fascinating, but it’s one of those towns that when I think of our customers, are they going to base themselves out of there? How are they going to get there? But if I was to go to a Tuscan town, I think Volterra has to be considered like a Luca. But yeah, Volterra was surprisingly beautiful. You could see the mountains of a clear day. You could see the mountains and behind the mountains, you can see the water, the Mediterranean, which was really wild being that high up and seeing that. But it’s a lovely, lovely, a Tuscan town with.

beautiful people, great food, but it was definitely not tourist, not a lot of tourists, but you could use it as a future Tuscan town to go to. It’s just not logistically and not built for tourism yet, I guess you would say. So it’s really good.

Brian Alex (35:16)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and

that is true. If it’s not set up for that or there’s not good inroads and getting in and out is difficult, we don’t see a lot of Americans going there, but you’ve got the Europeans that are coming down over the border, they’ve got their own vehicles, and so they’re gonna go to the places that are a little bit off the beaten path because they want those smaller…

microcosm experiences because they’re used to that. They’re not afraid of that and they’re going to use their secondhand English to get around and they do just fine in these northern northern towns. I definitely have to plug these smaller towns in Tuscany. We’ve talked about doing this in Umbria but in Tuscany as well there are some towns like this like you’re talking about that are

off that beaten path, not a lot of Americans there, but you have a real authentic, you know, microcosm experience here in Italy that I think is absolutely worth it, especially if it’s your second or third time coming over here to Italy and you’re ready to get off of that beaten path and do some experiences that are super authentic. Also, I have to say that one thing that I love about that area is the Etruscan you mentioned it.

the Etruscan history there. So you’re going back in time, you know, not just with the Roman history that is everywhere and probably top of mind when people first come over, but to go back even further in history and dig a little bit deeper down is super fascinating. I don’t know, that was a new experience for me last time I was up there digging into some of the museums that are absolutely incredible, but probably not top of mind for a lot of people coming over.

Ac (36:38)
Hmm.

Yeah, even Volterra, we were there with a guide, one of our partners, and she’s walking around, give us an overview, and we walked at this, you know, this little rail, and we’re looking down on the soccer field, and it was blocked off. And I’m like, what happened here? Well, there’s kids, they were playing soccer out there, and they found a rock, and the father happened to be an archaeologist, and he’s like, this rock is from a state of something, like they knew, he knew what it was, and he undugged his amphitheater. There’s a Roman amphitheater under the soccer field, now it’s all blocked off, and they’re

Brian Alex (37:30)
my gosh. Crazy.

Ac (37:34)
There you could see it now. Yeah. So was there’s a ton of history there that people don’t know about. Even though we went to San Gimignano, too, I was underwhelmed by it. Very touristy. We were there for three three nights. think Leonardo was with us, too. And then we stayed in Tritado, which is a real small town south of San Gimignano. If you want a real, you know, small town flavor has a train station there. Really easy to get in and out.

But San Gimignano food, thought it was really touristy, but it’s definitely cute and quaint, but definitely a two hour visit to get in and out. But I don’t know if you take a, almost like a pizza to me. You know, it’s beautiful, quick trip, I thought Volterra and Ciotaldo were definitely two little towns you should go visit.

Brian Alex (38:17)
Yeah, great information and some great perspective. I think we yeah, we’ve covered a lot of the trips that we’ve done just in the last six months. And coming up in 2025, we’re filling out our itinerary a lot for you know, this kind of purpose. What’s what’s authentic? What’s off of that beaten path? What makes it worth it? How do get in and out? What is what does that feel like for

folks coming over either on their first, second or third trip, what’s the best strategy, how do you travel well? And even if you’re planning to come over next year to Italy, not a lot of people are gonna be here in the next couple of months, because it’s winter time. Although I think there’s reason for that and we can talk about that on either the next episode or the one after and talk about the season that we’re in and what makes this worth coming over.

Ac (39:07)
Yeah, soon.

Brian Alex (39:14)
Maybe you’re planning now for next winter. Well, stay tuned to the next couple of episodes because we’ll dig into that. But all that to say in in learning, even if you’re putting some of these bigger towns on your radar, on your itinerary for 2025, understanding the season that we’re in, understanding where the tourism industry is, understanding what’s going on in Italy. We know, we mentioned Jubilee coming up. We’ll talk about that more in depth later. But all of that

goes in, it factors in and understanding, you know, just like we said at the beginning, your temperament, what do you need getting off that plane? What are the experiences you’re after? How do you make the most of it so you can actually absorb and enjoy as you’re doing whatever it is that you came all this way over here to do? How do you enjoy it? And that’s what we want to hopefully excavate and get down to the nitty gritty and find so we can expose that.

for people so that on their next trip, they are able to enjoy.

Ac (40:16)
Yeah, I mean, I know we had this conversation. It was kind of light. It wasn’t really in depth with Marquet and Abruzzo. But, know, this is why we do what we do, because, you know, we need to figure it out. mean, we go we go back on our notes and we’re like, maybe we shouldn’t have took a card there, but a card there, maybe we should have started there. So, you know, that’s what we do what we do. I mean, people think, you know, it’s all fun and games and Brian and Anthony are on the road. But it was a lot of laughs and a lot of like, all right, we take it. Why are we here? you no.

Brian Alex (40:40)
There was no fun and no games, I promise.

Ac (40:46)
No, no, there wasn’t.

But yeah, mean, you know, we do what we do because of those reasons, you know, because we’re thinking about, all right, how does this affect the client? What should we do different? know, you should have took a train. We should have took a, we should have took a car. So, and we figure that out and exactly, you know, not that hard, but it’s, you know, definitely knocks. But, you know, I think we, we figured out a little bit more on these trips and to discuss these on the podcast. Yes, definitely.

Brian Alex (40:59)
Yeah. School of hard knocks.

Yeah, so lots of fun things coming up guys. you’re again, if you’re just tuning in, you may want to go back and look at some of the topics covered in season three. There may be some things that stand out that might be helpful to you as you’re beginning to think and plan for your next trip coming over here to Italy. I’m excited about

not just talking about these itineraries and where we’re going next and what we’re doing and how people can travel well, that’s going to be underscoring everything that we talk about in this season four, but also starting to incorporate, involve some of our partners and talk a little bit more about some of the Italian vendors of experiences, whether winemakers or tour guides or

restaurants or hotels, whatever, as we begin to involve them, I don’t know, maybe even have them on the podcast at some point, but certainly begin to talk more about the experiences. I think that’s gonna help broaden people’s understanding, deepen it a little bit, so that as they’re, if they’re coming over on their own and as they’re choosing their own itineraries, they’re gonna travel better, well, travel well and travel better coming over.

Ac (42:07)
Love it. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brian Alex (42:35)
All that to say, if this is interesting to you and you like what we’re talking about and wanting to come over to Italy, do yourself a favor. Come over to Italy with Bella. Check us out online, italywithbella.com. I’m getting all choked up here thinking about it. But no, you can go to the website and you can sign up for a free consultation with Anthony and his wife, Denise.

Despite what you might think about Anthony his wife is super sweet and will probably be on that call as well And you’ll really enjoy talking to Denise, but these guys Love Italy. They’ve got it in their blood and it shows and they are genuine experts on how to travel Well when you’re coming over here to Italy, that’s Italy with Bella comm so that’s my plug for for this episode

Anthony, what would be, if you gotta throw one thing out there and say, hey, we gotta make sure that we hit this on one of the upcoming episodes, maybe it’s a place, maybe it’s an experience, maybe it’s something to do or to avoid doing when you’re coming over here to Italy, what would you say and we’ll put a pin in it and make sure that we hit this on an upcoming episode?

Ac (43:52)
I would think we need to talk about Italy in the fall. What’s going on with Italy? I think we talked about a little bit about that. And I think we need to look at these big cities like we just did with Rome and what can you do outside of those big cities, i.e. Amalfi. People lay at customers last week. They were there eight time in Amalfi. They’re not going back anymore because it’s too crowded. So these are the things we’re looking at as a company. How do we want customers that want to go to Amalfi, where do we put them and what do we do? I think that’s another pin we need to look at.

Brian Alex (44:20)
Okay, yeah, great. Thank you for that. I think that’s an excellent pin to put right here and we’ll pick up there next time. Definitely talking about the fall because it has been historically our favorite time of the season to come over. We’re also seeing that things change and climate changes and all of that stuff goes in and we have to roll with the punches and pivot. The fall this year has been really unpredictable and we’ve seen so much

Ac (44:32)
Mm-hmm.

Crazy.

Brian Alex (44:49)
change in what is our normal, you know, modus operandi. And so we’re having to pivot with that and helping people learn what’s changing will help them travel better in the future.

Ac (45:01)
Yeah, mean this fall, I normally we’re on a customer client call and we’re talking about, they ask us, June, July, September, October, September’s great. It rained like I’ve never seen. It was craziness. And I feel like I sold a bill of goods, I’m like, yeah, that boat ride can’t go today or tomorrow.

Brian Alex (45:10)
Yeah. Yeah.

You promised us sunshine!

Ac (45:20)
I am not God. I am not God. I’m Mother Nature, if you want to it that way. But yeah,

I I was very, I was there in April and September. I mean, those two times, I was also in June, but it rained a lot for those two months. It was crazy to me. So it was just, it was, you know, whatever. But also very crowded, like you said.

Brian Alex (45:41)
Well, we will pick up there next time, guys. Thank you for tuning in and until then, arrivederci.

Ac (45:48)
Arrivederci fan bella. Ciao ciao

Brian Alex (45:50)
Ciao ciao.